HOWEDY elegy you PATHETIC miserable stinkin rotten
lyin dog murderin punk thug coward active acute life-long
incurable manic depressive MENTAL CASE,
"elegy" <elegy@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:obs774htqkh2gk357iig069mf5s608qmdi@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On Tue, 08 Jul 2008 14:33:59 -0500, diddy <none> wrote:
>
>>The answer is, they are ignorant a GOOD breeder is
>> putting NOTHING into the shelters, and breeding
>> animals that have a lifetime of healthy animals.
THAT"S ABSURD>
> amen.
>
> and kudos to you for doing all the health testing on tuck.
Oh, for SHORE~!
Here's HOWE COME you had to CUT HOWET Harve's eye:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DzBtxevvcFs&mode=user&search=
> i am always glad to see good breeders with
> good dogs who are willing to PROVE it.
Perhaps you missed diddler's postin of Tuck's
GENETIC DEFECTIVE pedigree?
Here's elegy, PIT BULL RESCUER who MURDERED
her LAST FOUR CONSECUTIVE "rescue" dogs.
LIKE THIS:
Homer 1994 - 03.01.2007"
brothers and sisters i bid you beware
of giving your heart to a dog to tear
i put homer to sleep yesterday.
it was quite possibly the hardest thing i've ever done.
monday night i was trying to teach him to down using a
food lure. he wasn't getting it, so i put a hand on him to
try to encourage him to down. he attacked me, biting me
twice on the hand, and then when i stood up and backed
away, he came after me more and bit me on the leg as well.
i was shocked and devestated and a hundred other things.
i ended up emailing my trainer (who has turned out to be a
very kind friend) and she called me and i spent an hour on
the phone with her crying. she doesn't deal with aggression
cases, but she listened to me and talked me down. i hardly
slept that night.
tuesday i took homer in to work with me and had the vet
feel his neck. i didn't think it was a reaction due to pain
but i had to check it out. the vet put his hands on the sides
of homer's head and manipulated his head around. homer
didn't show any signs of pain or discomfort. he went
through the motions some more.
homer flipped out, with no warning, extremely violently. it
took him a long time (it felt like a lifetime. it was probably
around 3 minutes) to calm down enough that the vet could
take his hands off of homer without anybody getting hurt.
i went home for lunch and called a behaviorist. i spent a lot
of the day reading the brenda aloff aggression book and the
karen overall behavior book.
that night the behaviorist called me and i told her what had
happened and she asked questions and i answered them as
best i could.
she gave him a pretty poor prognosis.
everything that she said made sense to me, and nothing
she said was earth-shattering or even really anything
that i didn't already know.
this morning i took him in and held him close and cried into
his fur and told him how much i love him and let him go.
he was a dangerous dog. he bit unpredictably and with no
warning. he was a love, a snugglebug, a sweet sweet dog
as long as you didn't do anything he didn't want done. but
if you tried to "make" him do something he didn't want to
do, all bets were off. his reaction could be a snap or it could
be an over-the-top meltdown.
i couldn't live with a dog like that.
i *will not* live with a dog like that.
i've spent the last three days crying my eyes out. i never
imagined i could get that attached to a dog who i had for
all of 12 days and who bit me several times during those
12 days.
but i was. i loved him.
i loved him ferociously, but i had to let him go.
for his sake.
for my sake.
for the sake of luce and mushroom.
i feel horrible. heartbroken. guilty. angry.
and yet i don't regret him, not for one moment,
despite how things turned out.
Replies: 2 comments
i'm sorry, but human aggression is a deal-breaker, especially
unpredictable, unwarned human-aggression. there is too much
at stake and too much to lose.
Posted by e @[EMAIL PROTECTED]
03/26/2007 06:49 AM EST
You were just as unpredictable to Homer.
Shame on you for giving him only 12 days.
-----------------------
> dressing her up like that lures in so many innocent people bwahahaha
"bwahahaha"?
> "what kind of dog is she?"
> "she's a pit bull"
> "really??!!"
>
> it was all good responses yesterday, one hundred percent,
> which is awesomeness.
LUCKY THING her leis was coverin her PRONGED SPIKED PINCH CHOKE COLLAR
otherWIZE she'd of SCARED ordinary people.
> --
> http://underdogged.net
> x-no-archive:yes in headers
HOWE COME would you set your INFORMATIVE posts to
EXXXPIRE in six days, elegy? Are you EMBARRASSED
by your own words, you lyin animal murderin punk thug coward
mental case fraud an SCAM ARTIST, like montana, diddler,
professora melanie chang, cindy title moore of k9web.com,
and not so happy, not so handsome, not so gentle jackass, not
even jack morrison, a.k.a. BIG DADDY a.k.a. DOGMAN a.k.a.
tommy sorenson of sorenson's Retriever PUPPY MILL and
SHOCK COLLAR SALES??
Are they EMBARRASSED by their own words, the lyin animal
murderin punk thug coward mental cases frauds an SCAM ARTISTS?
matty aka Rocky EXXXPLAINS HOWE COME:
"Rocky" <2d...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
For reasons I'll only explain privately, I've gone no
archive, and it's a shame. Once in a while, while
looking for something else, I'll run into an old post
of mine. What an idiotic response! Whoops.
BWEEEAAAHAHAAAHAAHAAA!~!~!
Subject: Stress Induced Blindness - Effects Of Emotions On Glaucoma
HOWEDY People,
Fri, Sep 26 2003
Just re****ted this week from opthamologic society
that men who wear tight fitting neckties tend to have
MOORE glaucoma.
You can't be jerking and choking and scoldin your
dogs no MOORE. LIKE THIS:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DzBtxevvcFs&mode=user&search=
You're KILLIN and making your dogs go blind, to boot:
The most common precipitating events include illness,
emotional stress, trauma, intense concentration, and
pharmacologic pupillary dilation.[Sugar, 1941 #116; Lowe,
1961 #8957] The role of emotional stress in inducing acute
angle-closure should not be underestimated.[Inman, 1929
#190; Egan, 1955 #189; Cross, 1960 #188]
From: David Wright (djwri...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
)
Subject: Re: Effects of emotions on glaucoma
Newsgroups: alt.sup****t.glaucoma
Date: 1999/07/01
The role of stress in glaucoma is difficult to establish but
anecdotal evidence from many doctors suggests that it might
well play a role in glaucoma. As far as we know there are not
any clinical papers on the subject, indeed part of the problem
in investigating the relation****p of stress to any condition
is that the investigation itself tends to be somewhat
stressful. However, the best advice would be to keep stress
levels as low as possible without raising them again by
worrying about it.
David Wright MSAE
Chief Executive, International Glaucoma Association
While we are pleased to offer the above information, it is not
possible for the International Glaucoma Association to advise
on an individual patient's eye condition or treatment as this
has to be the role of their own doctor or eye specialist who
knows the full details of their particular case.
----------
In article <7lfuf7$f5...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>, m...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
>I seem to recall hearing on occasion the role of stress on
>eye pressure. My doc asked me on my last tonometry if I was
>under stress. However, after researching the subject I cannot
>find out anything. Many areas of medicine have acknowleged
>the role of stress reduction on things such as blood
>pressure, the immune system, pain sensitivity etc.
> What about things like anxiety, insomnia, anger, depression,
> etc and the effects on eye pressure. Is there any correlation?
>Does biofeedback have any effect on reducing eye pressure? If
>there hasn't been any research like this there should be! I
>would appreciate any thoughts on this subject.
>Thanks.
From: ritch (r...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
)
Subject: Re: Cerebrospinal Pressure,Glaucoma, etc.
Newsgroups: sci.med.vision, alt.sup****t.glaucoma
Date: 1996/01/26
2. Constant elevated IOP was shown to block axoplasmic
trans****t at the level of the lamina cribrosa a generation ago
by electron microscopic studies. However, it has more recently
been advocated that shear stress is just as im****tant. In the
latter case, changes in IOP can cause sliding of the plates of
the lamina cribrosa over each other, twisting and damaging the
axons that pass through it.
=========================
Natural Eye Care, An Encyclopedia: Complementary
Treatments For Improving And Saving Your Eyes Marc
Grossman, O.D., L.Ac. & Glen Swartwout, O.D. Keats
Publi****ng/NTC/Contem****ary Publi****ng Group, Inc.
4255 West Touhy Avenue, Lincolnwood, IL
60646 0-87983-704-7 $16.95
As well as being practicing optometrists, Dr. Marc
Grossman and Dr. Glen Swartwout have been trained
in Chinese medicine, acupuncture, and naturopathic
medicine.
Both have also published previous books. Their joint
effort, Natural Eye Care, An Encyclopedia: Complementary
Treatments For Improving And Saving Your Eyes, draws
from the best of traditional and modern medicine for the
prevention and treatment of eye disorders.
The authors say that their "primary goal is to offer a
practical approach to vision care based on an underlying
philosophy that emphasizes prevention rather than cure."
They begin with a fascinating discussion of how the eye
functions, including information like "the entire blood volume
of the body p***** through the eyes every 40 minutes or so."
Although many of us don't realize it, our eyes are the
first to suffer when we feel physical or mental stress. They
also cite studies showing that allergies in children improve
when their vision is enhanced through vision therapy.
Dr. Grossman and Dr. Swartwout devote one chapter to a
explanation of the various natural treatments and how they are
used for treating vision disorders.
They emphasize the "vision diet," which focuses on eating
lots of fresh foods and eliminating processed or refined foods.
They also discuss the role of Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM),
acupressure, herbs, physical exercise, eye exercises, spinal
adjustments, and homeopathy in preventing and treating eye
diseases.
Each of the following eye diseases have their own chapter:
glaucoma, cataracts, macular degeneration, dry eyes, sties,
floaters, and conjunctivitis (pink eye). The authors provide a
description of the causes and symptoms of each disease, and a
summary of conventional treatment. They then describe a
healing program for those who have each vision disorder, based
on natural treatments. Each chapter ends with a prevention
program for those who still have healthy eyes.
An appendix provides acupressure directions. They also
include an extensive reference section, and listing for resources
for those who can't obtain natural products locally.
Dr. Grossman and Dr. Swartwout say that "the good news
is that we don't have to be passive victims of eye disease. Eye
deterioration can often be stopped--and even reversed." Readers
will find Natural Eye Care, An Encyclopedia a comprehensive
and invaluable resource for the prevention and treatment of vision
disorders. Paper. 196 pp.
The Pit Bull Problem,
Breed Specific Legislation
And
The Pit Bull Fancier / RESCUER
HOWEDY People,
Thanks to katie aka elegy (elegy@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
),
a devHOWET Pit Bull RESCUER who's love and life revolves
arHOWEND RESCUING defenseless, misunderstood Pit Bull
Dogs, we have "The Pit Bull Problem":
HOWEDY elegy you miserable lying dog abusing punk thug
coward active acute long term incurable MENTAL CASE,
elegy wrote:
> On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 17:30:35 -0500, kate <kate@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> wrote:
>
> > I'm a new (and somewhat reluctant) owner of a pit bull.
> > I'm not sure this is the right place to ask, but I'm
> > giving it a shot.
Seems Kat AIN'T been PAYIN ATTENTION here on The
Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY
INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training
Method Manual Forums, eh elegy? You think you can
HOODWINK her into HURTIN her dog like HOWE you do
your dogs, elegy, you SHELTER / RESCUE dog lover?
> > Can pit bulls play with other dogs off leash?
A DOG IS A DOG, AIN'T THAT SO, elegy.
> > Can they ever be off leash
Just like ANY other BREED.
> > if not in a fenced area?
ONLY IF you know HOWE to install the come command as a
CONDITIONAL REFLEX as taught in your own FREE COPY
of The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100% CONSISTENTLY
NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW Wits'
End Dog Training Method Manual.
> i have two pits.
INDEEDY. And you jerk and choke them on your pronged
spiked pinch choke collar and SHOCK them to CONTRAIN
them in your yard and if they DON'T LIKE THAT you
take them to the SHELTER to be MURDERED for bein
AGGRESSIVE.
> one is nutsy around all other dogs
ALL AGGRESSION IS FEAR.
ALL FEAR IS CAUSED BY MISHANDLING.
> except his "sister",
MOST of HOWER DOG LOVERS can't keep their
own OPPOSITE *** dogs withHOWET fighting.
> but luce can play nicely with certain other dogs.
You mean when he AIN'T AFRAID.
> she's got a good standard poodle friend and a
> good goldendoodle friend, and she's played with
> a couple of other male dogs, always in a very
> controlled environment
You mean when you're standin right there ready
to THREATEN and HURT him if he acts AFRAID.
> and with careful and appropriate introductions.
BWEEEEEEEEEEEAAAHAHHAHHAHAAA!!!
> i would never ever ever take her to a dogpark though.
That's curiHOWES ain't it, elegy.
> ever.
On accHOWENT of your dogs are FEAR AGGRESSIVE
JUST LIKE the rest of these mentally ill lyin
dog abusing punk thug cowards for the same reason.
> she also can't be off-leash in an unfenced area
On accHOWENT of she'll RUN HOWET ON YOU on accHOWENT
of YOU CHOKE and SHOCK your dogs, isn't THAT correct,
elegy you miserable lying dog abusing punk thug coward.
> because her recall is lousy
DESPITE your SHOCK COLLAR, just like jeff dege's dog, elegy?
> in the face of anything she wants to chase.
INDEED? BWEEEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAHHAAAA!!!
> mushroom's recall is somewhat better
You mean he WON'T COME unless you can HURT him ENOUGH.
> but i still wouldn't take my chances.
On accHOWENT of you're a DOG ABUSING SIMPLETON.
> > With all the media hype about pits,
That MEDIA HYPE COMES FROM the Pit Bull Fanciers
like elegy. Isn't that correct, elegy. Remember
last week when you sent in that link with all
the EXXXCELLENT advice? They SELL SHOCK COLLARS.
They advised to break a dog of chasing his tail to
allow him to DO IT for a minute AND THEN IGNORE IT
despite that TAIL CHASING is an ANXXXIHOWESNESS
BEHAVIOR which can becom COMPULSIVE / OBSESSIVE.
> > and the different rescue websites
The RESPONSIBLE ETHICKAL RESCUE DOG LOVERS like elegy...
> > I've visited, it sounds like you never want them
> > to become overstimulated. If true, how do you keep
> > a hyper dog from becoming over stimulated?
HYPERACTIVE DOGS ARE MADE HYPERACTIVE BY DOG ABUSERS LOCKING THEM IN BOXES
and CHOKING and
SHOCKING THEM.
> i don't think you have to worry about them getting
> overstimulated so much as you have to worry about
> them being dog aggressive,
BWEEEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAAAA!!!
> which is absolutely normal for the breed.
THAT'S INSANE, elegy. THAT'S HOWE COME Pit
Bull dogs GOT a BAD REPUTATION you dog abusing
MENTAL CASE.
> some pit bulls are more dog aggro than others,
A DOG IS A DOG, elegy. You HURT INTIMIDATE
and MURDER dogs that SCARE YOU, elegy.
> some have very specific dislikes (luce hates female dogs
Luce is FEAR AGGRESSIVE of same *** dogs,
unlike your male dog who's FEAR AGGRESSIVE
of ALL dogs, isn't that correct, elegy.
> of similar body type and will try to eat them
> but small female dogs and giant female dogs
> seem to be ok).
THAT'S INSANE.
> some are just quick to take offense in play.
No, they're AFRAID on accHOWENT of YOU ABUSE THEM.
> luce is a very high energy dog.
You mean she's HYPERACTIVE.
> i take her to run in a fenced yard daily.
Or she'll GO INSANE JUST LIKE THE REST of HOWER
DOG LOVER'S FEAR AGGRESSIVE HYPERACTIVE DOGS:
"Max will go BONKERS if exercise deprived," marshall dermer.
> she and mushroom, my male, play a lot of tug and
> a lot of chase. when it was just her and me, we
> played a lot of tug and did a lot of training.
Your "TRAINING" is HOWE COME she's HYPERACTIVE and FEAR AGGRESSIVE.
> brain work seems to tire her out a
> lot faster than purely physical play.
Naaah? Do tell?
> (mushroom's pretty low energy. just walking
> and general play tires him out plenty.)
Oh. You mean he's hpothyroid, a STRESS INDUCED
AUTO-IMMUNE DIS-EASE aka The Puppy Wizard's SYNDROME.
> --
> read banned books.
> http://shattering.org
> x-no-archive: yes in headers
Seems Kat WANTS somethin LIKE THIS:
Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
From: elegy <e...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 23:09:44 -0400
Subject: Re: A question about pit bulls.
Note: The author of this message requested
that it not be archived. This message will
be removed from Groups in 20 hours
unknown history has less to do with the
possibility of fighting than genetics.
you can take the pit bull out of the pit but
you can't take the pit out of the pit bull.
personally i am not willing to risk my dogs'
lives by leaving two fighting breed dogs alone
together no matter how well they get along when
i'm there.
--
http://shattering.org
x-no-archive: yes in headers
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 09:36:24 -0400
Subject: Re: A question about pit bulls.
Note: The author of this message requested
that it not be archived. This message will
be removed from Groups in 6 hours
On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 20:49:57 -0400, elegy
<e...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
any *good* vet will take the dog at face value
and not muzzle or notmuzzle based on breed alone.
most pit bulls are actually fantastic at the vet
because they're such a people-loving and stoic
breed. i actually haven't yet had a bad experience
with a pit bull working in a veterinary environment,
even ones that were bad torn up from fights.
i know there are nasty pit bulls out there, and
fear-biters as well, but thankfully they're they
minority.
Newsgroups: alt.pets.dogs.pitbull
From: "Russ" <dontmailmeillmail...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:01:09
Subject: Re: A question about pit bulls.
L Alpert,
It's unknown how a just graduated from highschool 17
year old male will act in the Summer holidays at the
local hang out, when confronted by the bully that
bullied and tormented him throughout the last 5 years
of highschool.
He may fall in line or he may react. Your dog is just
maturing, he may decide to be lower in the pack for
his entire life. Especially if you sup****t the alpha.
BUT, if the pit decides in his own mind that it is
enough and decides to challenge for the top spot.
Your lifestyle will most likely change. All we are
trying to tell you is, be ready, be prepared, and
take precautions.
I don't know if you have seen a pitbull in its
virgin fight, but I can tell you they don't need
to taught to win against 99% of the other breeds
like rotties, gsd's, labs, etc. they will kick
ass and you will be mopping up.
Cleaning wounds and sticking your fingers into 1
nch deep gashes and punctures is not fun. And this
happened when I was there to break it up.
Imagine if you are not there to intervene. I am so
glad my dogs don't hate each other. Otherwise I would
have have a serious dilemma:) "X's fingers and thanks God"
===================
BWEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAHAHAHHAHHAHHAAAA!!!
Here's elegy aka katie doin her beast to IDENTIFY
the Pit Bull Problem and SAVE the Pit Bull from
harm by EXXXPOSING the rabid anti Pit Bull hysteria:
> you don't have to be a big-time pit bull
> activist to be aware of the pit bull problem.
A DOG Is A DOG;
As A KAT Is A KAT;
As A BIRDY Is A BIRDY;
As A CHILD IS A CHILD;
As A SP-HOWES Is a SP-HOWES
As A Mass Murderer Is A Mass Murderer.
> all you have to do is tune into the nightly news. it's
> there all the time. such and such pit bull attacked this
> child, this old person's little fluffy dog, the neighbor,
> etc etc etc. some of it isn't true-sometimes it's not pit
> bulls. and there are plenty of other dog attacks happening,
> but they aren't as fa****onable right now, so they're less
> likely to be re****ted (or their re****ted with "pit bull"
> in the headline despite the actual breed of dog).
> poorly bred blue pit bulls are prone to skin conditions like
> demodex (a type of mange which is a result of a poor immune
> system) and allergies.
CASE CLOSED, eh People???
> many of these problems have a genetic component
The Freakin Simply Amazing Puppy Wizard has DISCREDITED
the Canine Genome Project base on the DISCREDITATION of
the EXXXPERTS workin on it, dra. karen overall and her
"patients" professora melanie chang and her fear aggressive
hyperactive BC Solo, who, after FIVE YEARS of "TREATMENT"
and psychotropic anti psychotic medications has made NO
improvement:
"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It A Sharp
Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack Wouldn't
Have Done It If He Thought Solo Couldn't Take It. I Still
Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear He Might Eat My
Cat," Melanie Lee Chang * mch...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Canine Behavioral Genetics Project
University of California, San Francisco
http://psych.ucsf.edu/K9BehavioralGenetics/
From: Rocky (2...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
)
Subject: Re: How to handle aggressive situations
Date: 2004-10-19 19:42:54 PST
Melanie L Chang said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> I try really hard not to yell. The times that I have, Solo
> joined in and then lunged to the end of the leash.
Or, at the other end of the spectrum, Rocky cowers,
thinking I'm angry at him - a reason I don't "yuk out"
others' dogs at agility trials or training.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
> and while it wouldn't be possble to completely eliminate
> health problems through health testing, it is possible to
> lessen the chance of them.
That's ABSURD.
> responsible breeders get to know potential buyers.
Ahhh, THAT'S the SECRET to ETHICKAL BREEDIN,
AIN'T IT, dog lovers.
> they grill them.
Perhaps they should "catch and release" them?
> they care about where their dogs are going, and
> they keep track of them through their entire lives.
OtherWIZE they'd be COMPETING with their own BREED STOCK.
> they microchip pups before they leave.
Microchippin dogs to PREVENT ESCAPE??? That's ABSURD.
But it HAS been implicated in CAUSING CANCERS.
> they have tight and required spay/neuter contracts.
Surgical ***ual mutilation is unnecessary unethical
veterinary malpractice which ONLY benefits the
ETHICKAL VETERINARY MALPRACTICIONER
and ETHICKAL BREEDER <{):~ ( >
Here's a few FACTS your fellHOWE pathetic miserable stinkin
rotten lyin animal murderin punk thug coward active accute chronic
life-long incurable malignant maliciHOWES MENTAL CASES and
veterinary malpracticioners DON'T WANT YOU TO KNOW:
"Unlike what you will find in Spay/Neuter Fact Sheets,
the health impacts of spay/neuter that are discussed in
this paper are all backed up with citations to the veterinary
medical literature. You can find the paper here:
http://escregistry.kattare.com/healthEffectsOfSpayNeuterInDogs.pdf
http://www.neutering.org
Material that includes research data from 2006, 2005
was presented at ACC&D's Third International Symposium,
and part of the slideshows presentedare available here:
http://www.acc-d.org/2006%20Symposium%20Docs/Session%20I.pdf
Issues regarding previous assumptions on what neutering
does as a 'benefit' are pretty well challenged in this data above.
Alliance for Contraception in Cats and Dogs (ACC&D) is a
nonprofit 501C(3) group involved in attempting to study, define
and resolve some of the problems that currently exist internationally
as they regard issues of animal population control.
"More than 120 representatives from universities, animal welfare
organizations, foundations, companies, and government agencies
from 11 countries gathered to share information and plan for the
future". Main site: http://www.acc-d.org/
"On the negative side, neutering male dogs if done before maturity,
increases the risk of osteosarcoma (bone cancer) by a factor of 3.8;
this is a common ancer in medium/large and larger breeds with a
poor prognosis.
increases the risk of cardiac hemangiosarcoma by a factor of 1.6;
this is a common cancer and major cause of death in some breeds
triples the risk of hypothyroidism
increases the risk of geriatric cognitive impairment
triples the risk of obesity, a common health problem in dogs with
it the many associated health problems associated with obesity
· quadruples the small risk (<0.6%) of prostate cancer
· doubles the small risk (<1%) of urinary tract cancers
· increases the risk of orthopedic disorders
· increases the risk of adverse reactions to vaccinations
Hemangiosarcoma is a common cancer in dogs. It is a major
cause of death in some breeds, such as Salukis, French Bulldogs,
Irish Water Spaniels, Flat Coated Retrievers, Golden Retrievers,
Boxers, Afghan Hounds, English Setter, Scottish Terrier, Boston
Terrier, Bulldogs, and German Shepherd Dogs24.
In an aged-matched case controlled study, spayed females were
found to have a 2.2 times higher risk of splenic hemangiosarcoma
compared to intact females24.
A retrospective study of cardiac hemangiosarcoma risk factors
found a >5 times greater risk in spayed female dogs compared
to intact female dogs and a 1.6 times higher risk in neutered male
dogs compared to intact male dogs.25
The authors suggest a protective effect of *** hormones against
hemangiosarcoma, especially in females.
In breeds where hermangiosarcoma is an im****tant cause of
death, the increased risk associated with spay/neuter is likely
one that should factor into decisions on whether or when to
sterilize a dog.
Hypothyroidism
Spay/neuter in dogs was found to be correlated with a three fold
increased risk of hypothyroidism compared to intact dogs. The
researchers suggest a cause-and-effect relation****p26.
They wrote: "More im****tant [than the mild direct impact on thyroid
function] in the association between [spaying and] neutering and
hypothyroidism may be the effect of *** hormones on the immune
system.
Castration increases the severity of autoimmune thyroiditis in mice"
which may explain the link between spay/neuter and hypothyroidism
in dogs.
"Dr. Spain, who has been recently involved in many studies *****sing
the long-term risks and benefits of early-age neutering, presented
convincing data about the effects of spay/neuter on hip dysplasia,
cranial cruciate ligament rupture, long bone development, body
weight, diabetes, urinary tract infections, mammary cancer, and
several other conditions."
CONCLUSIONS
An objective reading of the veterinary medical literature reveals
a complex situation with respect to the longterm health impacts
of spay/neuter in dogs.
The evidence shows that spay/neuter correlates with both positive
AND adverse health effects in dogs. It also suggests how much we
really do not yet understand about this subject.
On balance, it appears that no compelling case can be made for
neutering most male dogs to prevent future health problems,
especially immature male dogs. The number of health problems
associated with neutering may exceed the associated health
benefits in most cases.
----------------------------
> they are willing to take their pups back at any time,
As they frequently must do.
> no matter what.
And then they MURDER them as bein UNFIT for WORKIN with people.
> they accept that they created them and are responsible for them.
AND THEY MURDER THEIR OWN DEFECTIVE DOGS.
> responsible breeders do NOT contribute
> to the number of dogs in the shelter.
Perhaps they DO by not meeting the market needs for
large numbers of ETHICKALLY BRED Pit Bull dogs <{); ~ ) >
Here's a ETHICKAL Grey HOWEND rescuer:
"After Numerous Training Cl*****, Behavioral
Consultations, And Hundreds Of Dollars In Vet
Bills, I Killed My Dalmatian Several Years Ago
Due To Extreme Dog-Aggressiveness," mustang sally.
"I'll bet you don't know a thing about me.
I volunteered as assistant to the euthanasia
tech at our local shelter for a while, and
I know a bit about overpopulation and unwanted
animals.
This however has nothing at all to do with
responsible breeders, because responsible
breeders don't contribute to that problem,"
Mustang Sally.
Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2001
Subject: Re: shock collars
Sally Hennessey <greyho...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:b8m1dtsv6vuiblo63h8ekqiforibadrff2@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
from being incredibly offensive and self-
righteous, this post shows and absence of knowledge
in the differences in dogs' temperaments, or perhaps
a lack of ability to perceive same.
The fact that you, Alison, have never met a dog to
whom corrections and discomfort, even pain, were
unim****tant does not mean that such dogs do not exist.
What it means is that you don't know as much about
dogs as you think you do, and you surely don't know
a damn thing about Harlan or anyone else's dog here.
I had a Dalmatian that would instigate fights with
one of her housemates; that dog had no fear or
anything, and pain incurred during a fight meant
nothing to her.
I know that that dog is not unique, and I'm sure many
people here can tell similar stories. The fact that
you, Alison, continue to say things to people such as
what you said to Theresa about causing her dog to
suffer (at least I guess that's what you meant by
"you cause your dog suffers" - - must be the King's
English you guys talk about over there) means that
you are an ignorant, arrogant, insensitive person
who is not worth further notice.
Sally Hennessey
"Sally Hennessey" <greyho...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:54nuetsqgkhp26qqv128jnumgmb2m27opr@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Nope. No more than you'd convince Patch that
prongs and e-collars, in the right hands, are not
intrinsically abusive; or that dogs trained properly
with prongs or e-collars are not fearful, in pain, or
intimidated; or that any one of us here knows our
own dogs and their reactions better than someone
who has never seen them or us...hmmm.
I'm starting to see some similarities here.
Sally Hennessey
-----------
> did i mention how few of these responsible breeders there are?
INDEEDY.
> an irresponsible breeder lets these dogs go to anyone
Like folks who'd allHOWE their ETHICKALLY BRED dogs to
go to dog parks and jeopardize the safety of J.Q. Pubic <{); ~ ) >
> and after the money has changed hands, they are done with
> the pups. these are the dogs that grow up to have unstable
> temperaments, or to be absolutely unsuitable for the family
> that bought them, to be too much work, to cost too much, to
> have health problems that the owners weren't bargaining for.
That's ABSURD.
> these are the dogs who get dumped in shelters every single
> day. these are the dogs running the streets, chained in the
> backyard, unsound in temperament.
No. These are the dogs who've been driven INSANE
by jerking choking shocking crating and surgical
***ual mutilation, poor diet and veterinary malpractice.
> but what can we do? i feel so helpless in the face of
> such rampant backyard breeding. i feel so helpless to
> do anything but talk myself blue about the problem and
> hope the word spreads.
We're workin on it, elegy...
> Coming Soon! Blogathon 2005 will be taking place on August
> 6, beginning at 9 AM Eastern time. My charity this year
> is Pit Bull Rescue Central.
SHAAAZZZAAAMMM!!!
> To sponsor me: my "campaign" information is listed here.
> In order to sponsor me, though, you have to register an
> account with the blogathon site. This doesn't mean you
> have to blog, stay up crazy hours, or anything like that.
> They just need your information in their system. From
> there you will be able to enter your pledge amount. It's
> supposed to be fixed so that it'll take you right back to
> my info, but if it doesn't, you'll unfortunately have to
> search through the campaigns. Mine is listed under the
.. name katie and the website shattering [dot] org. Thanks
> to everyone for your >sup****t!
> 08/06/2005: "11: the pit bull problem (part 2)"
> overbreeding is part one of the pit bull problem. it's
> a very significant part, mind you, but i don't think the
> most signficant part.
Agreed. The MOST SIGNIFICANT part is the Pit Bull Fancier
who jerks chokes shocks crates ribes intimidates and surgically
***ually mutilates their dogs whom they CANNOT CONFINE
despite their six foot privacy fence with shock barrier <{): ~ ( >
> irresponsible and uneducated owner****p of these dogs
> is the most significant part of the pit bull problem.
INDEEDY: The Pit Bull Fancier.
> people get these dogs because they're cool, because
> they're "dangerous", because they're there.
AND BECAUSE THEY NEED SAVING <{); ~ ) >
> they have no idea what they're getting into.
AS WE'LL SEE:
> these are very high maintainance dogs.
katie means they're HYPERACTIVE:
Sam Corson, Pavlov's Last Student Demonstrated At
UofOH Oxford, That Rehabilitation Of Hyperactive
Dogs Can Easily And Readily Be Done Using TLC.
Tender Loving Care Is At The Root Of The Scientific
Management Of Doggys. <{) ; ~ ) >
> they're prone to dog aggression.
THAT'S INSANE. ALL aggression is FEAR. ALL FEAR
is CAUSED BY MISHANDLING as HOWER Pit Bull
Fanciers promote in their ETHICKAL BREEDING campaines.
> they're athletic and rowdy. they will get out of your yard.
> luce has gotten out of the yard three times and she's never
> ever left unattended, with six foot privacy fencing even.
> she's been through the fence (nice of her to find the loose
> boards) and under the fence. i know she'll be over it one
> day.
Well then perhaps you should learn HOWE to
pupperly TRAIN your dogs, elegy aka katie???
And NHOWE, let's get on with the elegy murderin
her own DEAD RESCUE dogs SHOWE:
On Oct 26, 6:06 pm, elegy <el...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> On Fri, 26 Oct 2007 19:27:15 +0200 (CEST), Anonymous
> <nob...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> > Puppy is about 7 months old. I'm trying to teach him "come."
> > Sometimes he does it fine. Other times, he just sits there, looks
>> at me and ignores me. It is extremely frustrating.
That ain't hardly as frustrating as MURDERIN your own
last TWO DEAD "RESCUE" dogs on accHOWENTA you
ABUSED them, is it, elegy, you pathetic miserable stinkin
lyin animal murderin punk thug coward active accute
chronic life long incurable mental case.
> this is my favorite link for teaching a reliable recall
> <http://www.****rleychong.com/keepers/Lesson6.html>
Yeah? Your friend Mistress ****rley is a B&D/S&M SPECIALIST
who can't train the come command withHOWET her trusty SHOCK
COLLAR you pathetic lyin animal murderin ignorameHOWES:
Here's your PAL, MISTRESS ****rly chong,
crapHOWES CLICKER TRAINER:
"To be effective as a positive punisher, I set the level
of shock at a level high enough (in my best guesstimation)
to be unpleasant to the dog. I want the dog to startle a
bit and even yelp when they get shocked.
No, this is not pleasant.
After each shock, I call the dog again (because many
dogs tend to panic when something mysteriously reaches
out and stings them)."
But don't go away yet, my pretty flying monkey, there's MOORE:
"If the dog is still refusing the recall, then I escalate my
aversive a bit--usually, to taking two big handfuls of ruff
as I move backwards.
Some dogs do get "long line wise.""
No, some trainers are just long line stupid.
You can't force a dog to come.
"That is, they never refuse a recall while on the long line
but when the long line is gone, they are unreliable even if
the handler started with close recalls off lead in a familiar
(and safely fenced) area."
That's because you can't teach compliance with force no
matter HOWE gently you try to force. ANY force, even verbal
intimidation, will cause the opposition reflex to compel the
dog to do other than what you want.
Too bad you sharp trainers here don't understand that. It's
called positive thigmotaxis, and it's just as valid with a
choke collar as it is with a mental attitude. Force causes
the dog to not respond.
"IF the dog never ever refuses a recall while on the long
line, no matter what the distraction (and I am pretty good
at devising distractions for this test!), then I move to a
shock collar."
That's a competent clicker trainer, by golly!
Where do you people come off with that kind of crap?
Here's Miss ****rly, the CLICKER TRAINER you recommended to us:
Newsgroups: soc.subculture.bondage-bdsm
From: M ****rley Chong <eithne @[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 02:16:30 -0500
Subject: Re: OT Big dog problem. Serious help needed
MasterofDelight wrote:
> Welcome back, and it sure did not take you long to pick up on
> the dog training thread. As you can see, you commentary was missed.
Thanks!
Yes, there's nothing more likely to lure me out of lurk
mode than a training question. I'd planned to lurk for
a couple weeks to get up to speed again but before I
knew it, the keyboard was rattling.
> OB:bdsm Do you give advice on "puppy training" too?
Sure! I may not have a clue as to what I'm talking
about but that never stops me.
****rley eithne @[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.****rleychong.com
Newsgroups: soc.subculture.bondage-bdsm
From: M ****rley Chong <eit...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 13:48:53 -0500
Subject: Re: pregnancy and S&M?
dionysiangrrrl wrote:
> I just learned I'm pregnant, and while in most respects, I find it to be
> excellent news, I'm a little concerned about play time. I'm a fairly
heavy
> masochist used to frequent beatings and torture, and have held back from
> play so far until I get a little more advanced, just to be safe. But if
I
> make it healthily through the first trimester, does anyone have any
advice
> for pregnancy whompings? (Besides the fairly obvious "no more gut
> punches" rule :)
Congratulations!
My advice is to ask your doctor. Because your doctor is the
one who knows your specific conditions, because there's a
lot of advice out there of varying quality (including this!)
and because it's im****tant to have peace of mind that you
are doing the right thing at a time like this.
Most doctors have heard it all. If they haven't heard it all,
they should have. <G> If you have reason to believe that your
doctor may react badly then maybe that's an indication this
isn't the doctor for you.
Better to find this out now rather than when you are in
labor and not in the mood to holler at some rank narrow
mindedness and unable to gather your dignity and march out.
Those hospital gowns just don't cut it for dignified exits
unless you back out the door and then there's the little
problem of who is out in the hall.
Much easier in the long run to tell the truth.
****rley
Newsgroups: soc.subculture.bondage-bdsm
From: redneckpai...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(Joe Sergio)
Date: 17 Apr 2004 00:51:40 GMT
Subject: Re: OT Big dog problem. Serious help needed
JK said:
> Gee, let's see, why not take your dogs to a training school
> or ask your local police how they do it with their dogs?!
Ive already called the K9 officer in my town.
Left a message. He will get in touch with me.
> And I don't know do you think maybe slapping your dogs
> around so much and living with them, I mean all that
> attention you are giving them might just have something to
> do with why they like you and your family more than the
> neighbors?
I don't slap them around so much. I'll pop em, and all
when they do something wrong, and fuss at em. But I have
found something even better to make them stop what they
are doing.
A dustbuster. Just turn it on. Or show it to them. They
hate any type of va*** cleaner. It's worked about keeping
Jake out of the garbage. I sat in the kitchen a whole day,
and every time he went to the garbage can and went to stick
his head in, I turned it on. He stopped that.
Mainly I just pet them. They lay there by my chair and I
reach down and scratch them. They get up in the chair with
me. Tha'ts not easy when they are that big. But they still
think they are puppies. I do spoil them sometimes, but they
are my boys, and I love them.
> Hey, but this is the SSBB clearinghouse and you know the brain
> bucket is just outside and we do expect you to leave your brain
> there first before you post your problems here. Afterall, we all know
> that SSBB has all the answers you need for all your problems. Don't
> bother picking up your phone and calling around 'cause you got the
> good ole SSBB to help solve your problems.
You dumbass, I did call around and ask some advice from
other folks as well first. I posted it here because Miss
****rley trains dogs, and there are a few folks here who
know more about it than I do.
Why do you try to turn every post you reply to into a noncon
humiliation scene with you topping? Could it be that this is
the only action your getting? LOL
> Time to fetch your brain. Come on boy you can do it. There you go.
I'd ask you to fetch yours, but I don't think you can
see something that small without a microscope.
--
Joe
Suck a lifesaver today, put a fireman in your mouth.
--------------
Newsgroups: soc.subculture.bondage-bdsm
From: M ****rley Chong <eit...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2004
Subject: Re: OT Big dog problem. Serious help needed
Katharine H. wrote:
> He does pretty well in his "walking gear" -- which is what the prong
> and leash are. When I put the prong collar and leash on, he still
shows
> other aggression behaviors to new men in the house but does not lunge
> (because he doesn't tighten his leash on the prong.) I think he does
> pretty well with the leash behaviors (given he's got a run-of-the-mill
> owner-type).
What other sorts of behaviours does he show?
> He is mostly fine when we are off the property. He still must stay
> leashed, but the only people he shows aggression to are fly fisherman
> (something about the gear freaks him out) and other dogs. Other people
> he basically ignores. My biggest issue are other dog owners whose dogs
> are off leash and want to come up and say hello. My beast will play
well
> with a dog who submits, but will fight with one who doesn't.
I have a solution for that one. When some clueless idjit
allows their dog to come up to mine, I call over sweetly
"don't worry, the vet doesn't think he's infectious anymore."
A carryover from my years showing horses when idjits leading
a horse down the aisle of a barn would let their horse poke
it's head into my horse's stall. I'd grab a bottle of Ring-Ex
(ringworm medication) and start spritzing ostentatiously. And
mention that my vet thought we had the infestation cleared up.
I never mentioned that the bottle was full of plain water. <G>
If I'm not in a nice mood, I just scare the bejeebers out
of the oncoming dog to send it away. When they say "but
he's friendly" I say "well, I'm not." My dogs never have
to defend themselves on leash. I think they sort of enjoy
seeing me chase other dogs away, there's a certain smugness
in the way they lean against me while looking at the other dog.
> Bottom line though... this dog is killing my *** life because I can't
> introduce men into the house and I've been in the mood for men the past
> several months. I don't know what the hell I'm doing, so I've called a
> local trainer and she's going to teach me how to more effectively deal
> with the beast before I figure it's time to enter a monastary :-) This
dog
> is so docile with me... the contrast in behaviors is amazing.
Nooooo, not the monastary! Your scene re****ts are
incredibly good and would be a loss to pervkind.
****rley
Newsgroups: soc.subculture.bondage-bdsm
From: M ****rley Chong <eit...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: Wed, 14 Apr 2004 02:38:40 -0500
Subject: Re: OT Big dog problem. Serious help needed
I'm piggybacking from Nicole Diver:
> Katharine H. writes: "This is my new tactic -- my 3 yr old rottie/lab
mix
> has become *extremely* aggressive when new people, in particular men,
> come onto his territory. All people who are coming to my home for the
> first time are warned to expect aggression. They are then given the
option
> of dealing with the dog or not. If the new guests are not "dog people" I
> will make the choice for them and the dog will stay in the backyard
while
> I have people over. If they do want to make friends with the dog, then
the
> dog goes on a leash and prong collar when they enter the house. When I
> let them in, he is snarling, lunging, etc. As soon as the treats come
out
> it's
> a whole new ballgame. The pup sits and wags his tail and is ready to
> make friends. It generally takes time for him to warm up to new men."
Katherine, I have nothing against the use of prong collars
and recommend them when I feel it is appropriate. Just like
any tool, there are situations when a prong collar is the
best tool for a job and there situations where a prong
collar is the worst tool for a job.
Prong collars do tend to magnify a dog's aggressive tendencies.
If the dog is at all inclined to bite unreasonably, the prong
collar will often send it right over the edge.
<snip BD/SM and proceed directly to MURDER>
Re: homer bit me :(
"elegy" <el...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:e71pt2lsdt1sskllan43i2qdf5bp7iqcu1@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
ago and far away, Mary Healey <mhhea...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> did say:
>elegy <el...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in
>news:1m6nt2l1m8uiepjg04slfa9hg33ig1h7ta@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> i'm really disappointed in myself, because i wigged out on him for it,
>
> I'm not sure you should be. Maybe it's because I'm used to dogs that'll
> keep pu****ng barriers just to find the limits (if any), but the bottom
> line is that Homer did something completely unacceptable (for whatever
> good and justified reason) and discovered that, yes, there is an upper
> boundary beyond which his new human gets a bit testy. That's a good
> thing for a dog of any age to learn.
i worry that he reacted out of fear
and i gave him more reason to fear.
luce is a huge barrier-pusher. i've wigged out
on her a few times, too, and that i don't think
was necessarily a bad thing. but with this guy,
because he's kinda timid and i think kinda
fearful, i feel bad about.
>> i put him in his crate until i calmed down enough to not do
>> anything else stupid.
>
> Well, see, you learned something valuable. Homer learned
> something valuable. It's all good. Neither of you will need
> to repeat this particular lesson. I hope so, anyway.
i put a harness on him and he seems much more
comfortable with having that held. he simply
cannot be handle-less until he learns things like
come, stay, and to go in his crate.
--
And now, each night I count the stars.
And each night I get the same number. (Amiri Baraka)
http://shattering.org
x-no-archive: yes in the headers
-----------------------------------
Subject: i don't know what to do
From: elegy
Date: Monday, February 26, 2007
homer full-on attacked me tonight. multiple puncture wounds on my
hand, torn pants, dog that kept coming. he meant it tonight. he meant
to hurt me, not just to say "i don't like this".
i was trying to teach him to down using a lure and he totally and
completely wasn't getting it at all, so i was trying to physically
show him what i wanted. yeah. guess not.
i don't know what to do.
i have always said that i WILL NOT tolerate a dog who
bites, that i WILL NOT have a dog like that in my house.
it's easy to say when you're not faced with that, eh?
--
And now, each night I count the stars.
And each night I get the same number. (Amiri Baraka)
http://shattering.org
x-no-archive: yes in the headers
"diddy" <diddy@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:Xns98E5C5FE36862danny@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
thread news:uj6cu2937ccs8thufja20mgpc73l715r42@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
elegy
<elegy@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> whittled the following words:
Subject: Re: brothers and sisters, i bid you beware
> of giving your heart to a dog to tear.
>
> i don't remember what the last update i posted on homer was
> and i'm too tired and flat-out drained to go back and look.
>
> he saw the vet yesterday and wigged out and tried to hurt him. i spent
> half an hour on the phone with a behaviorist who was recommended both
> by my trainer and whom we recommend at work. she felt his prognosis
> was pretty grim and that he's dangerous. most of what she does is work
> with aggressive dogs. the only thing he has on his side in this is
> that he's on the small side. everything else about his biting is
> seriously bad news.
>
> i worked a half day today and spent the rest of it spoiling him,
> snuggling him, feeding him cookies and mcdonalds french fries.
> everytime he moves his head quickly i jump, in case he's planning on
> biting me.
>
> tomorrow morning i'll hold him close and whisper in his ear how much i
> love him and how sorry i am that his life was what it was, and send
> him on to a better place.
>
> and then i'll cry some more.
>
> i feel like i've been crying for two solid days.
>
> --
> And now, each night I count the stars.
> And each night I get the same number. (Amiri Baraka)
> http://shattering.org
> x-no-archive: yes in the headers
You meant so well. I'm so sorry
-------------
"diddy" <none> wrote in message
news:Xns99E154DAFFD50diddydiddynet@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
dog trainer must succeed. By nature, "Command" mentality
makes dog trainers a curmudgeonly lot. The deeper a dog
behavior digs in, the more willing a good trainer is to do
what it takes to uproot the undesired behavior.
This willingness to tackle what results in a battle of wills
is well pronounced in dog trainers. And if you think that's
something, try horse trainer lists, where the ante is upped X
1000 pounds and poor results can KILL you!
However, "nice little horsey " types are rarely successful
in horse training and rather self extingui****ng bringing
about more moderation in established techniques.
BWEEEAAAAHAHAAA~!
"I would not allow that behavior AT ALL. Inconsistancies
are going to come back and bite you. I don't understand
how, you as a trainer, don't comprehend this.
Having a 100% reliable dog does not
EVER allow for mitigated cir***stances.
A well-trained dog is a lifestyle.
You teach a dog to LEAVE it. A dog should be
taught to obey. I can call any of my dogs off
in full chase and ask them to drop anything
they are doing, and they will.
I think that should be expected of any breed, and
those who do not teach "leave it" fundementals
atre missing the boat"
Subject: Re: untrainable beagle! NEED HELP
"diddy" <di...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:Xns9834C98CEC696danny@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> in thread news:BO2Lg.4755$xV.1684@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
"graham
> fandango!" <gmey...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> whittled the following words:
> i have a ten year old beagle who i got from the animal
> shelter 5 years ago. its pretty clear he was abused in
> some form before he ended up in the shelter; when ever
> i reach for something, like the tv remote, too quickly he
> flinches. he gets scared when i sweep the kitchen floor
> and hides under the bed.
I have one too. I don't know her past history,or her age.
I use an antibark collar on her for my sanity. She's very
quiet, until I take it off. It doesn't train her not to bark,
because she barks when the collar is off. (beagles "Do
that")
There may not even be batteries in it, but she doesn't
bark... just in case.I'd supervise the first time you try
it, because I've heard of some dogs barking, and going
so spazzy over them that they died.
I really don't think you are going to train a dog that
age, especially a beagle, NOT to bark. I see your
options as being:
1) anti-bark collar
a)citronella
b)electronic
c)bark buster (your neighbors will
probably complain asmuch about
that as the howlng)
2) surgical debarking
3) placing the dog and accepting the consequences
4) moving
-----------------------
"diddy" <none> wrote in message
news:Xns9A74B7CCF8817diddydiddynet@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<barneytoe@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> spoke these words of wisdom in news:
5a8c97ed-06aa-
4211-b345-b49062effd09@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> The shock is minimal and nothing to worry about.
>
> There are 2 different types that frequent this group:
> the high falutin city folk that believe dogs should be
> treated like children, and the answer for any problem
> is "enroll them in class and spend $300 to teach them
> not to do it, and put them in time-out, but be sure
> their paw socks are on before stepping outside if under
> 50 degrees, etc."
First, I know of a dog with an antibark collar, who
protested so violently, he spazzed out and killed himself.
He was found dead in his kennel the next morning.
What dog training schools charge $300?
------------
"Cappy the beagle killed one of my ducklings today.
Tuck grabbed a leg, and swallowed a leg and thigh
before I could get him.
a month ago, he almost died from swallowing a
chicken wing. Now I'm sweating all over again.
I think he's never going to be allowed out ever
again without a muzzle! (he seems alright thus far.
------------------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >
Re: Tuck's SAR experience
"diddy" <d...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:Xns982D2E8C7C9D6danny@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
I just came in from putting chickens to bed, and Tuck
had my computer keyboard on the floor, and there are
now two keys missing.
Ornery git
-------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >
"diddy" <d...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:Xns9839861A82FF6danny@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> in thread news:m1s5g2lsio01rsk9iisfcjotfqigmljjnp@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Janet B
> <j...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> whittled the following words:
> Curious how many choose to crate a dog forever,
> whenever they leave the house and/or overnight,
> or how many choose to wean from household
> crate usage (usage being shutting the dog in the
> crate, not the dog choosing to hang out there) at
> some specific ages or maturity levels.
> Not for how long during a workday, but how
> long for a dog's lifespan?
I plan on crating Tuck whenever NOT supervised
(which isn't often.. he usually is with me) Until the
day that he quits tearing apart everything in sight
when I leave the room.
A dog proof room doesn't work.
He's figured out door knobs. He's figured out cupboards,
and he loves to tug open dresser drawers. He's not
interested in anything left out in the open.
He's into treasure hunting, figuring anything worth
secreting away is worth his effort discovering. He's
discovered the sock stash is in drawers.
Trash cans? --not interested.
Counter tops? --not interested
Counter tops -with food? --not interested
Dog food sitting on the floorin open bags? --not interested
razor blades from bathroom drawers? ... Very cool stuff!
Mom really gets bent too!
nope.. His crate is going to be occupied for
some time to come.
As for the beagle.. She's never been trustworthy.
She's getting senile and never will be trustworthy,
so a crate is in her future until she crosses the bridge.
Reka, no crate at no time, She lost her crate when she was
5 months old. Both Tuck, and reka hangout in crates by choice.
Reka dens in the bathtub usually. (kind of a crate) But she
likes the beagles vantage point, because the beagles crate
is on top of Tuck's. Right next to the window so she can see
out. Tuck prefers the compartment with a view as well.
I always have to vacate him (even though the crate on top is
too small for both elkhounds, it's their preferred lookout)
when I wantto stick in the beagle.
Reka sleeps under the bed at night or in the bathtub at night
if it's really hot. She sleeps in the bathtub by day when not
watching from the penthouse suite.
Tuck is not crated at night, and has chosen to sleep in
the closet. The beagle holds down the couch, night and day.
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BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >
> "diddy" <di...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
> news:JS76a.9623
>
>> Taya had eaten over 5 POUNDS of summer sausage!
>> I just had to laugh, because otherwise, I'd have cried.
>
> is taya an elkie? no point in crying over ingested summer sausage
> is what my mom used to say. did she get the runs?
Taya IS a 1/2 a cup a day for food elkie. When i told mom and dad
that she ate 5 POUNDS, we all marveled, my goodness! Where did she
put it all!
She went to the emergency vet clinic last night in a snowstorm
along 60 miles of ice slick roads, & blowing snow. The price
wasn't bad $120 but she had pancreatitis.
Crap, I should have induced vomiting when I realized it had happened.
Going from a regular diet of ounces in a day to 5 pounds
was bound to cause problems!
She seemed fine at the time, and I didn't think about it.
It could have been worse. There was NO fat in those summer sausages,
because they were homemade. No greasy texture, and much better than
any you buy. Because there was no fat, I had figured pancreatits
wasn't going to be a factor.
Wrong again.
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IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >
Hey **** for brains? Eatin kats won't cause peritonitis:
From: diddy
(di...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
)
Subject: Re: What would you do in this situation?
Date: 2002-05-31 14:49:22 PST
Actually, I borrowed the vets office kitten once for a
couple days for school education on pet care and safe
handling as well as responsible pet owner****p.
I kept the kitten over night in a crate within a crate
and yet my dog (yes, Angelic Danny, as well as Taya
and Toby tore that kittne to threads from between the
crate bars. (apparently he stuck his paws through the
crate to bat at the dogs. I was out doing yard work
and rushed in to find the little kittens pieces and
parts being torn through by ALL the dogs.
I called my girl friend to come get my dogs. I screamed
displeasure, and stalked out with the kitten. Danny, et
al spent 3 days in a kennel until I finally felt like I
could interact with them without doing bodily harm. All
three dogs were never touched, but knew they had done
something so unspeakable that I wouldn't associate with
them and they got banished.
To this day, Taya (mom and Dad's dog) and Danny will not
look at a cat. When confronted with one, Danny wees
himself and cowers hiding behind me for help.
I'm not saying this would work this way with all dogs, But mom
and dad now have a house cat, and she has never been
harmed by any of the dogs. Danny is there all the time,
unsupervised, and has no interest in harming the cat.
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IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >
Here's diddler trainin her neighbor's dog to stay HOWETA her garbage:
From: diddy (di...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
)
Subject: Re: Dog Shot, Neighbor Charged, Anchorage AK
I guess if I felt Danny was threatened, it's the way I would react.
There would be none left standing to deal with the threat just in
case.
If someone hurt him, I would not let borders or
continents stop me from pursuing justice.
Then again, I always feed Danny INSIDE. If someone is feeding
his dog outside, his own dog might not mean THAT much to him.
If he was feeding his dog outside though, many dogs are food
aggressive, and that could most certainly spark a dog aggression
thing. (and if the dog was penned quietly outside, what was it
doing in his yard?)
I shot a neighbors dog one night for chasing my horses and called
him to help me find it. I would do the same for threatening my dog.
My husband shot a dog that had been tearing up trash up and down
our road for years making an unbelievable mess. When we finally
killed the culprit, the whole road cheered. Animal control had never
been able in years to catch this critter. (we think it was feral it
was certainly unkempt enough to have been....and it had been shot
at by MANY of the neighbors, but it never frightened it off enough
to keep it from NOT tearing up the road the next trash day)
---------------
"I was in that position once when Becky was hit
by a car when my son left the yard gate open."
Fromdiddy <di...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 17:43:30 -0500
Subject: Re: Rural person needs help euthanizing his loving pet.
I think sedating her with benedryl until she was overly sleepy, and
injecting her with Epsom salts IV should cause such chemical
imbalance that it should do the trick.
I'm not sure how humane that would be, It would cause a heart attack.
Well placed gun shots are probably the most immediate, effective and
humane, but then, you said that was not acceptable. Carbon dioxide is
NOT humane.. it's slow and agonizing as the other g***** in car
exhaust burn out the lungs causing agonizing death.
Re: Question About Euthanasia - Not For Faint of Heart
"diddy" <di...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
in message news:Xns995C9D28D6616danny@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
if you are willing to be trolled. Using firearms
is not the most palatable way to put a dog down, but
sometimes it IS the most humane. For instance. I live
10 miles from a vet not an unreasonable distance for
routine care.
But one day, I was outside the fence in the company of
my dog, when the phone rang inside the house. I ran in
the door, and it was my dad. I said, "Dad, the dog did
not come in with me, I'll call you back"
Not aware that my dog had crossed the road to visit the
children getting off the school bus across the street,
I assumed her to be in her usual haunts, out in the back
pasture or barns.
I called her to come, and called her directly into the
path of a speeding car. She got hit directly on the
license plate and was thrown about 30 yards.
I knew exaclty what had happened, when I heard the
sickening thud, and her screams.
I rushed to her, and saw the blood streaming from her
ears and nose. her mangled little body irreparable. I
knew she was going to die. She quit screaming when I
went to her side. I went to move her, and she started
screaming even louder.
I knew moving her was only causing her greater agony.
She was in enough, and the outcome was not going to be
any better.
I decided to not put her through any more, and I left
her screaming, went in the house, got the handgun, and
returned. I gave her a tearful hug and apology. And I
did the hardest thing I've ever done in my whole life.
I took her pain, and made it my own. She immediately
slumped and went limp, and was silent. Quick. Taking
her to the vet was the poorer alternative.
in later years, I released a dog from the pound. She
was dumped for biting. Knowing that most of the time,
a dog that bites is the child's fault, I brought her
home to see if she was salvageable in a childless home.
She at least deserved an evaluation. She seemed fine,
then the following day, with no provocation, she lunged
for my throat. This was an unprovoked attack, and I knew
there was probably something physically wrong with the
dog (perhaps a brain tumor?) and regardless, she was a
HUGE liability risk, and I could never place her.
So I took her to the vet for euthanasia.
The vet kept sticking her for 15 minutes, and it was the
ugliest screaming death I ever witnessed.... until I had
my old 18 year old companion diagnosed with systemic
organ failure. Her old body wore out. I took her to the vet.
Apparently poor circulation caused her not to use the
euthanasia shot properly. The vet kept giving her one
shot after another, and she dies a slow agonizing death,
screaming, and looking at me in betrayal and dismay.
I wanted to grab her from the vet, and take her home,
and shoot her. It would have been over faster.
Then I took Danny in for Euthanasia. The best dog I've
ever had. The vet stuck him, and he went down HARD,
screaming.
He screamed for about 10 minutes.
If a vet was going to get a dog right, this one he HAD
to, and he didn't. I was furious. I'm forever sorry I
took him to the vet, but the violence of shooting him
was just unnacceptable to me.
These are THREE different vets.
I've witnessed hundreds of vet euthanasias that went
uneventfully. But those THREE failures stick forever
in my mind. Two on dogs very near and dear to me.
If I could accept the violence and had the fortitude
to do the job myself, those dogs would have never
needlessly suffered. A bullet properly placed is quick
and final.
Perhaps the OP has had not so good experiences, and
just wants to be sure the job is done right. I don't
necessarily consider them a troll (however I strongly
suspect that they are, and if they have to ask what
caliber to use, they probably are not a good enough
shot that they should attempt this)
------------------
Date: December 29, 2006 5:47 AM
Subject: Re: Dog chewing up floors
in thread news:aad9p2hg0aei5nijqludfvqhb8g1l0jsaj@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<mmmtobler...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> whittled the following
words:
> I, for one, am glad that the Puppy Wizard comes across
> as a complete loon given what his advice is since it
> makes it less likely that people will take it instead
> of the advice of someone else I think gives better advice.
For the record, The Puppy wizard over-rates himself. But
"his" (tm) methods are pretty much tried and true methods
that trainers have used and some still use today.
There are better methods out there now. But the ones posted
in his manual (now that he has removed the advice to SPIKE
a dog's temperature to dangerous levels) are sound. they work..
no matter what we think of the puppy-wizard and his packaging...
"his methods" <cough> are just as valid as anyone else's
"His methods" can stand some updating, and he definitely
needs to look at some repackaging.
Hopefully others add a slicker delivery to grab attention,
but truthfully, when you look at the cat fights that go on
here, and stand back and watch in perspective, it's rather
hard to determine the sane ones from the lunatics.
In fact, an awful lot of people here come off looking
rather tainted. A person needs to have a good filtering
device to sort out the noise.
TPW just has a problem that's too painfully obvious.
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