Re: Parrot worked to death?

On Sat, 15 Sep 2007 04:02:29 GMT, "M.J." <M.J.@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:

>
>"max" <betatron@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message 
>news:13emjp35cthgdc@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> In article <zDHGi.26846$eY.6692@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>,
>> "M.J." <M.J.@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>>
>>> I'll repeat once more!
>>>
>>> Is this what you did to the poor creature, Ms Irene Pepperberg?
>>>
>>> Have him worked to death by your research?
>>> 8-12 hours a day, every day, of gruelling mental exercise, just to
>>> find out where the limits of avian intelligence exist!  No wonder
>>> Alex died so young.
>>
>> What you are describing is a death due to prolonged mental stress. 
fine.
>>
>> Typically, when an animal, human or otherwise, is under chronic mental
>> stress,
>
>
>No, it is not fine, as the type of stress Alex was subjected to
>is not comparable to anything else that an animal may encounter
>in nature.
>
    Neither is talking in human language.

>Usually stress means fear, hunger, uncertainty, noise, many other
>environmental factors.  A 30 year rigorous regiment of learning
>to think abstractly, admionistered from the earliest age, is a stress
>factor different than anything a parrot can encounter and there is
>no way to judge how the creature will react to it (that is long term 
>effect).
>
    Really?  Problem solving is something parrots don't encounter
every day?

>In this case a long term consequense is apparently untimely death,
>or that is the suspicion.
>

    That is YOUR suspicion with a lack of credible evidence to back it
up other than your theory that may be proven false as the forensics
are conducted.

>I am certain that if it were a wild-caught bird that were subjected
>to Dr.Pepperbergs regiment of 8 to 12 hour per day mental
>exercise, not a human imprinted bird, you would have observed
>some more evident signs of distress. I suspect a wild caught bird
>would defend itself from the "abuse" or would have su***bed/expired
>much earlier.
>

     Your suspicions and speculations don't seem to be sup****ted by
the evidence so far.  You want to rant on about something you have no
evidence that sup****ts your assertion.
     It seems that you want to stir people up and start some sort of
campaign against the researchers and the university to satisfy some
inner need of yours.

>M.J.
>we observe manifestations selected from several dimensions of
>> measurable behavior and condition.  A trivial and incomplete list might
>> include significant weight change, diet selection change,  blood
chemistry
>> changes, sleep disorders, hair (or feather) pulling, self mutilation,
>> violence,  copraphagy etc.
>>
>> Given that Alex was, in fact, one of -- quite possibly _the_ -- most 
>> studied
>> parrot in all of history, one might reasonably expect to have seen 
>> evidence
>> of some sort of stress disorders.
>>
>> Where is your evidence of such stress?  I've seen the same films as 
>> everyone
>> else of Alex (some presented by Dr. Pepperberg herself, in fact) and
i've
>> never seen as much as the hint of a scintilla of evidence of any
>> stress-related pathology, mental or physical, in the bird.
>>
>> So what is your secret evidence?
>>
>>
>> Grueling mental exercise, my aunt fannie.
>>
>> .max
>> more like the best care and play time a parrot could ever hope for. 
>




James F. Mayer                              
President                                   
J F M Electronic Systems, Inc.                                        
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