HOWEDY william clodius, you pathetic miserable stinkin
rotten lyin animal abusin punk thug coward active acute
chronic life long incurable malignant maliciHOWES
MENTAL CASE,
"William Clodius" <wclodius@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:1infhe9.qz5m807w4o13N%wclodius@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Glad to get the update.
His new RESCUE dog BIT him for PUNI****NG IT, billyboy.
AND his veterinarian/behaviorist CAN'T HEELP him other
than to prescribe ANTI-PSYCHOTIC medications that DON'T
WORK <{}: ~ ( >
> Keep up the good work.
What would you call DISMAL FAILURE, billy?
Subject: Re: Update on the American Eskimo
HOWEDY william clodius, you pathetic miserable stinkin
rotten lyin animal abusin punk thug coward active acute
chronic life long incurable malignant maliciHOWES
MENTAL CASE,
"William Clodius" <wclodius@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:1imcn6z.181yjuyn218c1N%wclodius@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
been a UNDIAGNOSED MENTAL CASE all your life:
"FWIW I believe I have Asperger's, but that diagnosis only
became common in the 90s, several decades after the time
in life when that diagnosis might have been very useful to me."
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
> Jim:
jimmy got ALL the INFORMATION he NEEDS to
rehabilitate his newfHOWEND RESCUE dog. Only
PROBLEM is, jimmy DON'T LIKE the INFORMATION.
Perhaps he needs a DIAGNOSIS, eh william?
> You have a long haul in front of you,
Yeah, but his mental CONdition AIN'T GOT NUTHIN to
do with his DOG, william, it's got to do with jimmy's own
mental illness, just like you an the rest of your pathetic
miserable stinkin rotten lyin animal murderin punk thug
coward active acute chronic life long incurable malignant
maliciHOWES mental case PALS here on The Sincerely
Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply Amazing, Majestic
Grand Master Puppy, Child, *****, Birdy, Goat, Ferret,
Monkey, SpHOWES, And Horsey Wizard's 100%
CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL
FREE WWW Wits' End Training Method Manual Forums
And Human And Animal Behavior Forensic Sciences
Research Laboratory <{}: ~ ( >
> but if you can make it to the end you will find that its worth it.
Yeah. ALL temperament and behavior problems are CAUSED
BY MISHANDLING therefore they CAN BE CURED NEARLY
INSTANTLY simply by DOIN EVERY THING EXXXACTLY
PRECISELY OPPOSITE of HOWE you and your pathetic miserable
stinkin rotten lyin animal murderin punk thug coward active acute
chronic life long incurable malignant maliciHOWES mental case
PALS here PREFER <{}: ~ ( >
> You seem to be started in the right direction at the right pace.
You mean askin LYIN ANIMAL MURDERIN MENTAL CASES
who's own dogs GOT THE SAME PROBLEMS for the SAME
REASONS, william?
What benefit would a DIAGNOSIS have been for you, william?:
"FWIW I believe I have Asperger's, but that diagnosis only
became common in the 90s, several decades after the time
in life when that diagnosis might have been very useful to me."
Would it have made you a KINDER, GENTLER, more
CONsiderate human being? No, billyboy, it would have
perpetuated an justified your pathetic self concerned nature.
> Keep it up and let us know what sight you see along the way,
jimmy's fixin to hire a BEHAVIORIST, billy boy <{}: ~ ( >
> or if you get lost and need some directions.
Yeah. Perhaps he'll ask *you* or paul e. schoen or janet or
diddler or handsome gentleman jackass morrison, or marquis
de "READ KOEHLER FOR CONTENT" shaw or matty a.k.a.
Rocky for ADVICE, eh billy boy?
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <pst...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
It is a shame that Muttley will probably be put
down (his appointment is next Wednesday),
-----------------------
HERE'S HOWE COME:
"Loop the lead (it's basically a GIANT nylon or leather
choke collar) over his snarly little head, and give him a
stern correction" --Janet Boss
Here's paulie's CUSTOM MADE pronged spiked pinch choke collar:
http://tinyurl.com/5m6ppt
"J1Boss" <j1b...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:20040324071828.07753.00000001@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
He was next to me and I could see his neck
muscles pulsing. He didn't even blink an eye.
Janet Boss
"sionnach" <rhyfe...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:c3qi15$2biuoh$1@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> "J1Boss" <j1b...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
> news:20040323173916.10096.00001938@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > I can't imagine needing anything higher
> > than a 5 with it, even with an insensitive
> > dog like a Lab.
An INSENSITIVE DOG???
> > I can't remember what model of Innotek I have, but
> > I had a pointer ignore a neck-muscle-pulsing 9.
Do you think the citronella collar is CRUEL
cause the SMELL LINGERS after the dog's
been sprayed in the face and the dog won't
know HOWE COME IT was MACED?
janet CONtinues:
> > My dogs are not human children wearing fur- they are DOGS.
> > I don't have anything against electronic bark collars, but they
> > should be used in conjunction with actually working at training
> > your dog(s).
They're DUMB ANIMALS these MENTALLY ILL LYING
DOG ABUSERS HURT INTIMIDATE and MURDER.
-------------------
HOWE COME would these EXXXPERTS set their
INFORMATIVE POSTS to EXXXPIRE in six days
matty a.k.a. Rocky, elegy, montana, diddler, professora
melanie chang, cindy title moore of k9web.com, and
not so happy, not so handsome, not so gentle jackass,
not even jack morrison, a.k.a. BIG DADDY a.k.a.
DOGMAN a.k.a. tommy sorenson of sorenson's
Retriever PUPPY MILL and SHOCK COLLAR SALES??
Are they EMBARRASSED by their own words, the lyin animal
murderin punk thug coward mental cases frauds an SCAM ARTISTS?
matty aka Rocky EXXXPLAINS HOWE COME:
"Rocky" <2d...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
For reasons I'll only explain privately, I've gone no
archive, and it's a shame. Once in a while, while
looking for something else, I'll run into an old post
of mine.
What an idiotic response!
Whoops.
---------------------------
BWEEEAAAHAHAAAHAAHAAA!~!~!
From: Mark Shaw <ms...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: Sat, 22 Dec 2007 19:38:17 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: Re: usenet anonymity
Some people freak out over pseudonyms. I don't know why.
I use a fake name on another newsgroup. Why? Without getting
into too many details, it's to avoid possible hard feelings should
what I post there be revealed to certain friends or coworkers in
real life.
But the name I'm known by there is real, and it's legitimately mine
in a sense - it's the name of the imaginary friend I had when I was
three or four years old. And I don't change it around; nor is it
intended to defraud or otherwise harm anybody.
So: meh.
--
Mark Shaw (And Baron)
-----------------------
SHAAAZZZAAAMMM???
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.behavior
From: ms...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(Mark Shaw)
Date: 2000/01/27
Subject: Re: To Jerry Howe and Other Professed Trainers!!!!!
In article <10413-3890B6D...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>,
asl...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(Melissa Wright) wrote:
>
> I have read all of the WEDTM, I do not agree with all of it, but
> some of it does make since. I do use noise distraction to a certain
> degree myself.
>
> I would also like to say, I read the Forced Fetch training from
> Oak Hill Kennel, If that is how Cindy Title Moore and Amy
> Dahl train, I wouldn't let them train my PIG let alone a dog.
>
> I would much rather train and have my dogs trained by Jerry Howe
> then twist my dogs ears,like you are told to do in this training.
You have been seriously misinformed. Moore and Dahl are among the
more competent people around here. You know all those FAQs posted to
rec.pets.dogs.info? Cindy is the one responsible for maintaining and
posting them. And neither of them are abusive.
As far as Howe, he's one of the LEAST competent people here,
and he's almost certainly responsible for misinforming you about
the others.
What Howe and other bedwetters, wankers and PeTA-pukes do
is latch onto some technique or other intended to train a particular
life-threatening behavior out of a dog as a last resort, and claim
that every person who agrees that that method used in that setting
is appropriate is a horrible sadist. This is libel, pure and simple,
and if Howe keeps it up he may eventually find himself in civil court.
Example: dogs who must work near rattles****s are best and most
quickly trained to leave them alone via electonic-collar training,
performed by people who are familiar with E-collars and competent
in their use.
This is analogous to slapping a child's hand when he reaches for a
hot stove -- a moment of very minor pain in exchange for a behavior
modification that will prevent major pain or crippling injury or even
death later. Let someone express that opinion here, though, and Howe
will pursue that person relentlessly, spewing hateful crap about how
they're sadists who "get off" on shocking and burning dogs and trying
to sell people his magic sound box (which apparently does not even
exist) instead.
The man's a nut. Don't pay any attention to him. Don't take my
word for it, though -- hang around a little while, read others'
thoughts on him, and make up your own mind.
(Aside to Vagabond-Mom: seewhutimean?)
[posted and emailed]
--
Mark Shaw (and Maggie)
-------------------
Sez on our FAQ'S pages at K9 Web you should knee the dog in
the chest, step on its toes, throw him down by his ears and climb
all over it like a raped ape growling into his throat and bite IT on
his ears, or leash pop it on a pronged spiked pinch choke collar
or pop him in the snout with the heel of your palm.
"Many People Have Problems Getting The Pinch Right, Either
They Do Not Pinch Enough, Or They Have A Very Stoic Dog.
Some Dogs Will Collapse Into A Heap. About The Ear Pinch:
You Must Keep The Pressure Up," sindy "don't let the dog
SCREAM" mooreon, author of HOWER FAQ's pages on k9 web.
"Don't Let Your Dog Scream. Use Your Hand To Hold
His Muzzle Closed And Tell Him To Quit Moaning,"
Sindymooreon.
--------------------------
lying frosty dahl wrote:
"I Would Never Advise Anyone To Slap A Dog
I Do Not Believe There Is A Single Cir***stance
Ever, Where Slapping A Dog Is Anything But
Destructive," "I don't see why anyone would want
to choke or beat a dog, or how any trainer could
possibly get a good working dog by making them
unhapper, fearful, cowering, etc." sez amy lying
frosty dahl.
lying frosty dahl sez she doesn't twist:
"None of my posts, prior to or subsequent to
Jerry Howe's attacks, encourage anyone to
twist ears, beat dogs, confront, intimidate,
frighten, or any of the crap he constantly
attributes to me," lying frosty dahl.
lying frosty dahl, oakhill kennels wrote:
Get A 30"- 40" Stick.You can have a helper wield
the stick, or do it yourself. Tougher, less tractable
dogs may require you to progress to striking them
more sharply
Try pinching the ear between the metal casing and
the collar, even the buckle on the collar. Persist!
Eventually, the dog will give in
but will squeal, thrash around, and direct their
efforts to escaping the ear pinch
You can press the dog's ear with a shotshell
instead of your thumb even get a studded collar
and pinch the ear against that
Make the dog's need to stop the pinching so
urgent that resisting your will fades in im****tance.
CHUCK IT Under ITS Chin With That Ever Ready
Right Hand, As it catches on, try using the stick
and no ear pinch.
When the dog is digging out to beat the stick
and seems totally reliable without any ear pinch,
you are finished
If the dog drops it, chuck it solidly under the chin,
say "No! Hold!"
(stay on the ear until it does) (perhaps because
the ear is getting tender, or the dog has decided
it isn't worth it)" lying frosty dahl.
"Chin cuff absolutely does not mean slap,"
professora gingold.
terri willis, Psychoclown wrote:
"Nope. That "beating dogs with sticks" things is
something you twisted out of context, because you
are full of bizarro manure."
"Pudge Was So Soft That She Could And
Would Avoid A Simple Swat On The Rump
With A Riding Crop," lying frosty dahl,
discoverer of CANNIBALISM in Labradors.
Borrowed from: "Puppy Raising Tips" from
professional trainers, John and Amy Dahl.
"Around four months many puppies can withstand a
correction. Unfortunately this is the time they start
teething and if their mouth hurts, they may act
generally sensitive. If this is the case, be patient and
wait for all those baby teeth to fall out.
In training, retrievers often respond to physical correction
better than verbal correction. While "NO!" is extremely
useful if puppy is about to bite an electrical cord or steal
food off the table, when you are teaching them something
(like obedience) a sharp jerk on their lead or swat with a
stick gets the message across with less emotion and less
effect on their confidence.
If they drop the dummy and act like their mouth hurts
when they are teething, stop all retrieving and wait for
their mouth to feel better. A correction should be just
severe enough to get the dog to respond.
Repeated weak corrections are very stressful to the dog."
"John ran out, grabbed Blackie by the collar, and gave the dog
two or three medium whacks on the rump with a training stick
while holding him partially off the ground. John then told Blackie
to sit, ran back to the line and cast him back to the dummies."
The Puppy Wizard sez a mom dog eatin her babies to SAVE
THEM from a fate like that, is COMMENDABLE. We're gonna
teach folks THAT AIN'T NORMAL...
From: ms...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(Mark Shaw)
Date: 27 Aug 2001 23:00:48 -0400
Subject: Re: Anyone tried the Wits End Training manual?
In article <3532-3B895199...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>,
Momi...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(misty) wrote:
> I needed the info, it was offered free of charge
> and any questions can be asked of Jerry.
This is not true, unless you're willing to kiss his, uh, ring.
If you're not, he considers you his enemy -- no matter how you
really feel about him -- and will just abuse you.
Of course, his sheep have always ignored
this and will probably continue to do so.
--
Mark Shaw (and Maggie)anti-spam: change 'bang' to 'not'
------------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
From: Mark Shaw (ms...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
)
Subject: Re: Fido-Shock
Date: 2002-04-10
In article <gWLs8.203228$af7.101030@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>,
"Coleman Brumley" <clbrum...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>> Has anyone had experience with this product (Fido-Shock).
>> If so, what model number, voltage, etc.?
> "If you're talking about the pet-grade hotwire system,
> I have one. It's to keep boarded dogs out of my flowers."
Seems our pal marquis de "read koehler for content" shaw runs
an unlicensed illegal "cottage industry," outta his HOWES, a
B+B for dogs.
>> I have a 1.5 year St Bernard who is scaling (not clearing -
>> - more like falling over) our 4 foot fence to visit with
>> owners walking their dogs.
My methods cure fence jumping and escape behavior in a couple
minutes without shocking and choking and crating and beating
and shooting "a good slingshot or a few BB's" as instructed
in our koehler book that we should read for content. ed w of
petloss dot CON recommends we read koehler, sez he could be
the world's best trainer.
>> I thought of raising the fence a foot or so,
Because there's no way to train a dog not to jump a barrier.
>> but don't think that'll solve the problem.
Course not. Neither will hurting him, that'll
make IT want to escape even MOORE.
>> I've tried watching her outside, and give a stern "NO"
>> when she props on the fence for a peek over it. No avail.
Course not. That'll make him try harder soon as you're not lookin.
>> I've heard this product works after just a couple of tries.
> I take it you're considering running the wire across the top of
> the fence? I don't think I'd recommend that, although it may be
> worth a try."
Course. Might as well try to HURT the dog to force it not to
want to run away. Dogs run away from their HOWESES for the
same reason kids do... they're usually abused and neglected,
even despite the daily jerk and choke and shock training.
> Watch closely -- the one case where I saw a hotwire used
> in this fa****on caused the dog undue stress and frustration,
That was on one of your illegal customer's dogs who didn't know
you was fixin to BURN their Dane while you was giving him some
loving care. Those stupid bastards trusted you not to HURT their
dog...and you done your best, but just couldn't bear NOT to HURT.
> and he tried even harder to get over the fence.
Of course, marquis. That's what got Peach DEAD.
> So be prepared to take it down right away.
So he don't get caught, marquis? He's not shocking an illegal
boarding customer's dog like you were... marquis de "READ
KOEHLER FOR CONTENT" shaw <{}: ~ ( >
> That was a Dane, though.
Yeah. A cash customer's dog. You couldn't afford to return IT
with a case of nervous aggression...and you couldn't get caught
with a hotwire just in case the dog squeals on you by his new
nervous responses.
> With a Saint things might be different.
Yeah. Did you see CUJO?
--
Mark Shaw (and Maggie) anti-spam: change 'bang' to 'not'
--------------------
"Tricia9999" <tricia9...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:20021117101433.10365.00000067@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> how effective are these electronic fences in
> keeping a dog on a property????
Some run through it. Others get shocked and become
too scared to go out in the yard anymore.
Just heard of a guy that has to rehome his dog,
because the dog got caught right in the path of
the shock and will now not go near his person,
won't go outside.
Just hides under a desk in the house.
------------------------------------
"micha el" spam_yurs...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
in message
news:yIydnZpPsIzg6l_d4p2dnA@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Anyway, contrary to your PR, this is what
it felt like to me when I got shocked by
Hope's collar.
It felt like a bomb going off in my
hand and forearm.
--------------------------
THAT'S HOWE COME Misty's DEAD DOG
Peaches got DEAD on us <{}: ~ ( >
LIKE THIS:
From: misty (Momi...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
)
Subject: Re: Jerry, why non-physical praise?
Date: 2002-01-23 07:46:16 PST
Beth wrote:
> So, jerry's techniques didnt' work for Peach?
Never had a chance to try them on her... I was still
using the e-fence and chains to keep her in the yard.
The suggestions I received here to keep Peach home
were: build a fence... wasn't going to happen.. we plan
on putting a modular home here within the next few years...
put more fence at the top of the pen I used so both dogs
could play bitey face w/o tangling, and similar suggestions.
Jerry was the only one to mention border training... but he
was kook supreme ;-P So I ignored him... no killfiles with
webtv.. at that time Jerry had his own troll, somewhat like
Candace, so the group was not very conducive to learning
anything. At one point I even b*tched about Jerry.
By the time I tried out Jerry's manual Peach had
already ran away.
Not very good at the google groups search but you'll find my
first post at "runaway dog message 30" within that thread is
mention of the dogs taking off and being gone for 2 days. I
stopped posting for a bit... my middle boy was devastated that
his dog was gone... Zelda came home but not her mom.
The next few posts from me were ones about/to Jerry.
Then Jerry made the WETM accessible for webbes, I put it in
my e-mail ( no storage otherwise on webby unless you put stuff
on a webpage) and read it, read it and read it.
Once I understood what the concept was, I implemented it on
Zelda. It worked and I now have a great housedog!
I only regret that my own distrust of Jerry caused me to lose
another wonderful dog. Peach was an absolute gem with little
kids. I and my boys still miss her. Sometimes I still look
to see if she came home when we get back from trips. Maybe
Peach would still have ran away... I don't know and never
will....
~misty
-------------------
"misty" <Momi...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote in message
I don't now whether Peach is dead or alive. I do
know she's not here with us. I really can't blame
anyone here for her loss.
I'm the one who ignored your advice. I did it
because of how you write/wrote. I was unwilling
to accept the idea that my using a shock collar
could have any bearing on Peach not wanting
to stay home.
Up until I started using it my main concern had
been keeping my dogs in their own yard.
Once I started using the e-fence... well, then my
concern became how to keep them from running
off for days on end.
I lost valuable training time becoming embroiled
in the anti-shock debate and the "Jerry sux" tirades.
I lost one dog but I have the bestest dog in the
world now <g> A Wits End Trained dog, one who
is completely housetrained, doesn't chew up stuff,
stays in the yard, and doesn't bark all the time.
IOW a great companion and friend.
Thanks Jerry!
================
misty" <Momi...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:6946-3B6337A1-329@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
We just installed a PetSafe brand fence this Spring.
Two dogs, two collars We now have one dog and
no collars.
Peach and Zelda would run thru the fence, not want
to come back in the yard and would run for days.
The last time, Peach didn't come back home.
I used the Wit's End Training Manual to learn how
to train my dog. She is now border trained. A few
minutes each day reinforces her desire to stay in
the yard.
She no longer runs out into the road, I can stop
her from chasing cats and she no longer cringes
when we walk around the yard.
I can not say loud or long enough how much I
hate the e-fence and its collars. If you can't get
a regular fence then you need to train your dog.
I will never rely on an electronic collar to
keep my dog in our yard again.
The price was too high:-(
~misty
-----------------
From: Momi...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(misty)
Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2001 14:44:25 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Re: Anyone tried the Wits End Training manual?
I used the Wit's Ends Training manual to teach myself how
to interact with Zelda. The first read through made no
sense to me...the second time through, things clicked and
the little lightbulb glowed.
I trained Zelda to stay in the yard, not chase cats, to come,
sit ,down, stop chewing toys and to be quiet when she barks
at things she hears outside.
I don't care if 99% of the manual came from 99 other trainers...
I needed the info, it was offered free of charge and any questions
can be asked of Jerry.
One thing about his method, although you can "spot" train
with it, it works best by a pyramid approach.IOW start
at the beginning and go through the exercises in the order
he has them wrote.
The part about "non-physical praise" confused me until I
tried a little experiment. I petted Zelda and told her
what a good girl she was...she enjoyed it, tail wagging.
I then put my hand away from her (behind my back) and
praised her...she got very wiggly, ****ged me with her nose,
pawed at me and wanted more praise. Not very scientific,
I know, but it was interesting to me how excited she got.
I find that I'm starting to use Jerry's method to "train"
my kids as well:-)
~misty
My "daughter" http://community-2.webtv.net/Momisty/ZeldaAnneArensdorf/
My sons http://community-2.webtv.net/Momisty/Arensdorf14Acre/
From: Charlie Wilkes <charlie_wil...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2001 14:13:46 -0400
Subject: Re: Anyone tried the Wits End Training manual?
On Sun, 26 Aug 2001 14:44:25 -0500 (CDT),
Momi...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(misty) wrote:
> I find that I'm starting to use Jerry's method to "train" my kids as
> well:-) ~misty
> My "daughter":
> http://community-2.webtv.net/Momisty/ZeldaAnneArensdorf/
> My sons: http://community-2.webtv.net/Momisty/Arensdorf14Acre/
Hi Misty!
I had just about exactly the same experience with Jerry's manual.
I had visited quite a few dog-training web sites, and, while they
didn't recommend anything too harsh, they all emphasized that
I must "assert my dominance" over the pup.
Anytime I tried doing that (just once or twice) it produced a
distinctly negative result... The pup got scared and ran away.
When I took the approach of simply making myself into the most
im****tant and desirable thing in her world, she responded incredibly
well. Now I can even break off a rabbit chase instantly (which I do
NOT want to allow, as I live in a rural area with chickens and
livestock) just by calling her once in a calm, affectionate voice.
Your kids and your dog are adorable, BTW!
You can see my pup at
http://www.geocities.com/viscouspuppy
Check the "more pictures" link -- like your dog, Holly
is more than happy to do an "alpha rollover" when I use
the gentle, non-confrontational approach Jerry recommends.
Charlie
================
NHOWE GET THE HEEL HOWETA MY FORUMS
and TAKE THESE DOG ABUSIN MENTAL CASES
WITH YOU, marquis:
"diddy" <none> wrote in message
news:Xns99E154DAFFD50diddydiddynet@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
dog trainer must succeed. By nature, "Command" mentality
makes dog trainers a curmudgeonly lot. The deeper a dog
behavior digs in, the more willing a good trainer is to do
what it takes to uproot the undesired behavior.
This willingness to tackle what results in a battle of wills
is well pronounced in dog trainers. And if you think that's
something, try horse trainer lists, where the ante is upped X
1000 pounds and poor results can KILL you!
However, "nice little horsey " types are rarely successful
in horse training and rather self extingui****ng bringing
about more moderation in established techniques.
BWEEEAAAAHAHAAA~!
"I would not allow that behavior AT ALL. Inconsistancies
are going to come back and bite you. I don't understand
how, you as a trainer, don't comprehend this.
Having a 100% reliable dog does not
EVER allow for mitigated cir***stances.
A well-trained dog is a lifestyle.
You teach a dog to LEAVE it. A dog should be
taught to obey. I can call any of my dogs off
in full chase and ask them to drop anything
they are doing, and they will.
I think that should be expected of any breed, and
those who do not teach "leave it" fundementals
atre missing the boat"
Subject: Re: untrainable beagle! NEED HELP
"diddy" <di...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:Xns9834C98CEC696danny@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> in thread news:BO2Lg.4755$xV.1684@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
"graham
> fandango!" <gmey...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> whittled the following words:
> i have a ten year old beagle who i got from the animal
> shelter 5 years ago. its pretty clear he was abused in
> some form before he ended up in the shelter; when ever
> i reach for something, like the tv remote, too quickly he
> flinches. he gets scared when i sweep the kitchen floor
> and hides under the bed.
I have one too. I don't know her past history,or her age.
I use an antibark collar on her for my sanity. She's very
quiet, until I take it off. It doesn't train her not to bark,
because she barks when the collar is off. (beagles "Do
that")
There may not even be batteries in it, but she doesn't
bark... just in case.I'd supervise the first time you try
it, because I've heard of some dogs barking, and going
so spazzy over them that they died.
I really don't think you are going to train a dog that
age, especially a beagle, NOT to bark. I see your
options as being:
1) anti-bark collar
a)citronella
b)electronic
c)bark buster (your neighbors will
probably complain asmuch about
that as the howlng)
2) surgical debarking
3) placing the dog and accepting the consequences
4) moving
-----------------------
"diddy" <none> wrote in message
news:Xns9A74B7CCF8817diddydiddynet@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<barneytoe@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> spoke these words of wisdom in news:
5a8c97ed-06aa-
4211-b345-b49062effd09@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> The shock is minimal and nothing to worry about.
>
> There are 2 different types that frequent this group:
> the high falutin city folk that believe dogs should be
> treated like children, and the answer for any problem
> is "enroll them in class and spend $300 to teach them
> not to do it, and put them in time-out, but be sure
> their paw socks are on before stepping outside if under
> 50 degrees, etc."
First, I know of a dog with an antibark collar, who
protested so violently, he spazzed out and killed himself.
He was found dead in his kennel the next morning.
What dog training schools charge $300?
------------
"Cappy the beagle killed one of my ducklings today.
Tuck grabbed a leg, and swallowed a leg and thigh
before I could get him.
a month ago, he almost died from swallowing a
chicken wing. Now I'm sweating all over again.
I think he's never going to be allowed out ever
again without a muzzle! (he seems alright thus far.
------------------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >
Re: Tuck's SAR experience
"diddy" <d...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:Xns982D2E8C7C9D6danny@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
I just came in from putting chickens to bed, and Tuck
had my computer keyboard on the floor, and there are
now two keys missing.
Ornery git
-------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >
"diddy" <d...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:Xns9839861A82FF6danny@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> in thread news:m1s5g2lsio01rsk9iisfcjotfqigmljjnp@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Janet B
> <j...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> whittled the following words:
> Curious how many choose to crate a dog forever,
> whenever they leave the house and/or overnight,
> or how many choose to wean from household
> crate usage (usage being shutting the dog in the
> crate, not the dog choosing to hang out there) at
> some specific ages or maturity levels.
> Not for how long during a workday, but how
> long for a dog's lifespan?
I plan on crating Tuck whenever NOT supervised
(which isn't often.. he usually is with me) Until the
day that he quits tearing apart everything in sight
when I leave the room.
A dog proof room doesn't work.
He's figured out door knobs. He's figured out cupboards,
and he loves to tug open dresser drawers. He's not
interested in anything left out in the open.
He's into treasure hunting, figuring anything worth
secreting away is worth his effort discovering. He's
discovered the sock stash is in drawers.
Trash cans? --not interested.
Counter tops? --not interested
Counter tops -with food? --not interested
Dog food sitting on the floorin open bags? --not interested
razor blades from bathroom drawers? ... Very cool stuff!
Mom really gets bent too!
nope.. His crate is going to be occupied for
some time to come.
As for the beagle.. She's never been trustworthy.
She's getting senile and never will be trustworthy,
so a crate is in her future until she crosses the bridge.
Reka, no crate at no time, She lost her crate when she was
5 months old. Both Tuck, and reka hangout in crates by choice.
Reka dens in the bathtub usually. (kind of a crate) But she
likes the beagles vantage point, because the beagles crate
is on top of Tuck's. Right next to the window so she can see
out. Tuck prefers the compartment with a view as well.
I always have to vacate him (even though the crate on top is
too small for both elkhounds, it's their preferred lookout)
when I wantto stick in the beagle.
Reka sleeps under the bed at night or in the bathtub at night
if it's really hot. She sleeps in the bathtub by day when not
watching from the penthouse suite.
Tuck is not crated at night, and has chosen to sleep in
the closet. The beagle holds down the couch, night and day.
--------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >
> "diddy" <di...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
> news:JS76a.9623
>
>> Taya had eaten over 5 POUNDS of summer sausage!
>> I just had to laugh, because otherwise, I'd have cried.
>
> is taya an elkie? no point in crying over ingested summer sausage
> is what my mom used to say. did she get the runs?
Taya IS a 1/2 a cup a day for food elkie. When i told mom and dad
that she ate 5 POUNDS, we all marveled, my goodness! Where did she
put it all!
She went to the emergency vet clinic last night in a snowstorm
along 60 miles of ice slick roads, & blowing snow. The price
wasn't bad $120 but she had pancreatitis.
Crap, I should have induced vomiting when I realized it had happened.
Going from a regular diet of ounces in a day to 5 pounds
was bound to cause problems!
She seemed fine at the time, and I didn't think about it.
It could have been worse. There was NO fat in those summer sausages,
because they were homemade. No greasy texture, and much better than
any you buy. Because there was no fat, I had figured pancreatits
wasn't going to be a factor.
Wrong again.
-------------------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >
Hey **** for brains? Eatin kats won't cause peritonitis:
From: diddy
(di...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
)
Subject: Re: What would you do in this situation?
Date: 2002-05-31 14:49:22 PST
Actually, I borrowed the vets office kitten once for a
couple days for school education on pet care and safe
handling as well as responsible pet owner****p.
I kept the kitten over night in a crate within a crate
and yet my dog (yes, Angelic Danny, as well as Taya
and Toby tore that kittne to threads from between the
crate bars. (apparently he stuck his paws through the
crate to bat at the dogs. I was out doing yard work
and rushed in to find the little kittens pieces and
parts being torn through by ALL the dogs.
I called my girl friend to come get my dogs. I screamed
displeasure, and stalked out with the kitten. Danny, et
al spent 3 days in a kennel until I finally felt like I
could interact with them without doing bodily harm. All
three dogs were never touched, but knew they had done
something so unspeakable that I wouldn't associate with
them and they got banished.
To this day, Taya (mom and Dad's dog) and Danny will not
look at a cat. When confronted with one, Danny wees
himself and cowers hiding behind me for help.
I'm not saying this would work this way with all dogs, But mom
and dad now have a house cat, and she has never been
harmed by any of the dogs. Danny is there all the time,
unsupervised, and has no interest in harming the cat.
------------------------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
IDIOT <{}: ~ ( >
Here's diddler trainin her neighbor's dog to stay HOWETA her garbage:
From: diddy (di...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
)
Subject: Re: Dog Shot, Neighbor Charged, Anchorage AK
I guess if I felt Danny was threatened, it's the way I would react.
There would be none left standing to deal with the threat just in
case.
If someone hurt him, I would not let borders or
continents stop me from pursuing justice.
Then again, I always feed Danny INSIDE. If someone is feeding
his dog outside, his own dog might not mean THAT much to him.
If he was feeding his dog outside though, many dogs are food
aggressive, and that could most certainly spark a dog aggression
thing. (and if the dog was penned quietly outside, what was it
doing in his yard?)
I shot a neighbors dog one night for chasing my horses and called
him to help me find it. I would do the same for threatening my dog.
My husband shot a dog that had been tearing up trash up and down
our road for years making an unbelievable mess. When we finally
killed the culprit, the whole road cheered. Animal control had never
been able in years to catch this critter. (we think it was feral it
was certainly unkempt enough to have been....and it had been shot
at by MANY of the neighbors, but it never frightened it off enough
to keep it from NOT tearing up the road the next trash day)
---------------
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.behavior
From: Janet B <ja...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 20:34:21 -0500
Subject: Re: Fenced yard for escape artist
On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 19:42:08 +0000 (UTC),
ceb <ce...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> Any tips for the best fencing/containment system?
>--Catherine
>& Zoe the cockerchow
split rail w/wire with the IF backup
--
Janet B
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com
-----------------
From: d0006...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(Julia F N Altshuler)
Date: 8 Apr 2001 12:27:57 GMT
Subject: Re: Lost dog - Pointe-Claire, West Island of Montreal
I know this advice is late, and I hope it's not hurtful at this point,
but we got an electric fence Cubbe, and it's working great.
She used to escape the regular fence and cause us all the anxiety
you're currently going through. Every time we though we'd thought
of everything to make the fence secure, she'd find another way out.
The wire for the electric fence now goes up next to the real
fence so she gets zapped if she goes too near.
Now she can enjoy running around her yard but can't get close
enough to the fence to figure out a way under, over or through.
Best wishes. I really do know what you're going through.
--Lia, building good memories with Cubbe --"
---------------------------
GOOD MEMORIES LIKE THIS:
"Might Cubbe Be Ready For Harsher Training Techniques?
I'd call the SHOCK fence effective and safe.
Humane is one of those hot words that people
can debate all day so I won't touch that one.
There are people who would call a regular chain
link fence inhumane," liea altshuller.
"I know this is a hard subject to bring up without
starting the whole cruelty thread again so I'll
state my opinion once and won't defend it further:
any method can be cruel for some dogs.
Even the slightest punishment was wrong for Cubbe at
the beginning, but we've come a long way since then.
She trusts us now as I mentioned in a recent post.
Point is, she's been rewarded for coming, but she's
never been punished, even in the mildest way, for
not coming.
Is it time for that?
What might I look for to tell?"
"Julia Altshuler" <jaltshu...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
wrote in message news:McYnb.45145$ao4.106231@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
After talking with the vet yesterday and watching
Cubbe all day today, I'm convinced that the shaking
is behavioral, not physical. Naturally I'll continue
keeping an eye on her, but when I add everything
up, I don't see symptoms of anything neurological--
and the vet agrees.
--Lia
"Things are beginning to get much worse day
by day and the vets seem unable to help:
http://tinyurl.com/fbqnw
THAT'S AN OCD. His owner CAUSED IT by
MISHANDLING and ABUSING his dog according
to the BEST advice of HOWER Gang Of Lying
Dog Abusing Punk Thug Cowards And ACTIVE
LONG TERM INCURABLE MENTAL CASES and
ASYLUM ESCAPEES.
LIKE THIS LYIN DOG ABUSIN MENTAL CASE:
"I was in that position once when Becky was hit
by a car when my son left the yard gate open."
Fromdiddy <di...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 17:43:30 -0500
Subject: Re: Rural person needs help euthanizing his loving pet.
I think sedating her with benedryl until she was overly sleepy, and
injecting her with Epsom salts IV should cause such chemical
imbalance that it should do the trick.
I'm not sure how humane that would be, It would cause a heart attack.
Well placed gun shots are probably the most immediate, effective and
humane, but then, you said that was not acceptable. Carbon dioxide is
NOT humane.. it's slow and agonizing as the other g***** in car
exhaust burn out the lungs causing agonizing death.
Re: Question About Euthanasia - Not For Faint of Heart
"diddy" <di...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
in message news:Xns995C9D28D6616danny@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
if you are willing to be trolled. Using firearms
is not the most palatable way to put a dog down, but
sometimes it IS the most humane. For instance. I live
10 miles from a vet not an unreasonable distance for
routine care.
But one day, I was outside the fence in the company of
my dog, when the phone rang inside the house. I ran in
the door, and it was my dad. I said, "Dad, the dog did
not come in with me, I'll call you back"
Not aware that my dog had crossed the road to visit the
children getting off the school bus across the street,
I assumed her to be in her usual haunts, out in the back
pasture or barns.
I called her to come, and called her directly into the
path of a speeding car. She got hit directly on the
license plate and was thrown about 30 yards.
I knew exaclty what had happened, when I heard the
sickening thud, and her screams.
I rushed to her, and saw the blood streaming from her
ears and nose. her mangled little body irreparable. I
knew she was going to die. She quit screaming when I
went to her side. I went to move her, and she started
screaming even louder.
I knew moving her was only causing her greater agony.
She was in enough, and the outcome was not going to be
any better.
I decided to not put her through any more, and I left
her screaming, went in the house, got the handgun, and
returned. I gave her a tearful hug and apology. And I
did the hardest thing I've ever done in my whole life.
I took her pain, and made it my own. She immediately
slumped and went limp, and was silent. Quick. Taking
her to the vet was the poorer alternative.
in later years, I released a dog from the pound. She
was dumped for biting. Knowing that most of the time,
a dog that bites is the child's fault, I brought her
home to see if she was salvageable in a childless home.
She at least deserved an evaluation. She seemed fine,
then the following day, with no provocation, she lunged
for my throat. This was an unprovoked attack, and I knew
there was probably something physically wrong with the
dog (perhaps a brain tumor?) and regardless, she was a
HUGE liability risk, and I could never place her.
So I took her to the vet for euthanasia.
The vet kept sticking her for 15 minutes, and it was the
ugliest screaming death I ever witnessed.... until I had
my old 18 year old companion diagnosed with systemic
organ failure. Her old body wore out. I took her to the vet.
Apparently poor circulation caused her not to use the
euthanasia shot properly. The vet kept giving her one
shot after another, and she dies a slow agonizing death,
screaming, and looking at me in betrayal and dismay.
I wanted to grab her from the vet, and take her home,
and shoot her. It would have been over faster.
Then I took Danny in for Euthanasia. The best dog I've
ever had. The vet stuck him, and he went down HARD,
screaming.
He screamed for about 10 minutes.
If a vet was going to get a dog right, this one he HAD
to, and he didn't. I was furious. I'm forever sorry I
took him to the vet, but the violence of shooting him
was just unnacceptable to me.
These are THREE different vets.
I've witnessed hundreds of vet euthanasias that went
uneventfully. But those THREE failures stick forever
in my mind. Two on dogs very near and dear to me.
If I could accept the violence and had the fortitude
to do the job myself, those dogs would have never
needlessly suffered. A bullet properly placed is quick
and final.
Perhaps the OP has had not so good experiences, and
just wants to be sure the job is done right. I don't
necessarily consider them a troll (however I strongly
suspect that they are, and if they have to ask what
caliber to use, they probably are not a good enough
shot that they should attempt this)
------------------
Date: December 29, 2006 5:47 AM
Subject: Re: Dog chewing up floors
in thread news:aad9p2hg0aei5nijqludfvqhb8g1l0jsaj@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<mmmtobler...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> whittled the following
words:
> I, for one, am glad that the Puppy Wizard comes across
> as a complete loon given what his advice is since it
> makes it less likely that people will take it instead
> of the advice of someone else I think gives better advice.
For the record, The Puppy wizard over-rates himself. But
"his" (tm) methods are pretty much tried and true methods
that trainers have used and some still use today.
There are better methods out there now. But the ones posted
in his manual (now that he has removed the advice to SPIKE
a dog's temperature to dangerous levels) are sound. they work..
no matter what we think of the puppy-wizard and his packaging...
"his methods" <cough> are just as valid as anyone else's
"His methods" can stand some updating, and he definitely
needs to look at some repackaging.
Hopefully others add a slicker delivery to grab attention,
but truthfully, when you look at the cat fights that go on
here, and stand back and watch in perspective, it's rather
hard to determine the sane ones from the lunatics.
In fact, an awful lot of people here come off looking
rather tainted. A person needs to have a good filtering
device to sort out the noise.
TPW just has a problem that's too painfully obvious.
--------------------
Here's your pathetic miserable stinkin rotten lyin animal
murderin punk thug coward active acute chronic life-long
incurable malignant maliciHOWES MENTAL CASE pal matty:
HOWEDY matty you pathetic miserable stinkin
rotten lyin dog abusin punk thug coward active
acute chronic life-long incurable malignant malici-
HOWES mental case and illegal doggy day care
operator FRAUD and SCAM ARTIST,
"Rocky" <3dogs@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:Fri9AFEF33195DF5australianshepherdca@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> "Tom Ginkel" <tginkel@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> said in
> rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
>
>> Does any have any experience with citronella collars or the
>> sonic collars that make a high-pitched sound when the dog
>> barks for longer periods. I won't use a shock collar, I
>> have seen bad results and it just seems nasty.
Yeah. Dogs GO INSANE when they're jerked choked shocked an
sprayed in the face with aversives an locked in a box an IGNORED
when they cry <{}: ~ ( >
> I don't like the idea of citronella collars.
INDEED? Oh, you mean on accHOWENTA they lack the
PRECISION of a CORRECTION with a nice SHOCK or
pronged spiked pinch choke collar, matty?
> I don't know sonic collars.
HOWEver, you DO know they're an AVERSIVE / PUNISHMENT
and you likeWIZE know aversives / punishments DERANGE behaviors
and make dogs INSANE an DEATHLY ILL with psychogenic seizures
like your own dogs got, wouldn't you agree, matty?:
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.health
From: Rocky <3d...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: 5 Sep 2007 15:09:21 GMT
Subject: Lightning strikes again
It looks like Friday had a seizure this morning. He couldn't
stand on the kitchen floor but could walk somewhat when I
got him outside, though he kept falling down. He was fully
recovered after about 10 minutes of lying on the lawn, then
he threw up. Prior to my seeing these symptoms, he was only
out of my sight for a few minutes and I didn't hear anything.
Needless to say, he's scheduled for a blood test.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
HOWE COME would matty set his INFORMATIVE POSTS to
EXXXPIRE in six days like elegy, montana, diddler, professora
melanie chang, cindy title moore of k9web.com, and not so happy,
not so handsome, not so gentle jackass, not even jack morrison,
a.k.a. BIG DADDY a.k.a. DOGMAN a.k.a. tommy sorenson of
sorenson's Retriever PUPPY MILL and SHOCK COLLAR SALES??
Are they EMBARRASSED by their own words, the lyin animal
murderin punk thug coward mental cases frauds an SCAM ARTISTS?
matty aka Rocky EXXXPLAINS HOWE COME:
"Rocky" <2d...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
For reasons I'll only explain privately, I've gone no
archive, and it's a shame. Once in a while, while
looking for something else, I'll run into an old post
of mine.
What an idiotic response!
Whoops.
---------------------------
BWEEEAAAHAHAAAHAAHAAA!~!~!
> You didn't explain what type of shock collar or why they're nasty.
INDEED? Perhaps THIS will heelp, matty?:
B.F. Skinner: Re-evaluation of Punishment
Punishment, unfortunately traditionally overused,
actually has been proven not effective at long-
term behavioral change, and creatures will find
other ways of getting what it wants. In "Freedom
and the control of men" American Scholar, Winter
1955-56, 25, 47-65. 1956 he states:
If we no longer resort to torture in what we call
the civilized world, we nevertheless still make
extensive use of punitive techniques in both
domestic and foreign relations. And apparently for
good reasons. Nature if not God has created man
in such a way that he can be controlled punitively.
People quickly become skillful punishers (if not,
thereby, skillful controllers), whereas alternative
positive measures are not easily learned.
The need for punishment seems to have the sup****t
of history, and alternative practices threaten the
cherished values of freedom and dignity.
Fear involved with punishment causes frustration:
with typical results loathing, hostility and apathy.
Skinner's teaching on the superiority of posittive
reinforcement's benefits for keeping desired behavior
have proved very valuable.
----------------------------
In the followin SCIENTIFIC RESEARCH STUDY, you may
substitute pronged spiked pinch or slip choke collars for shock
and add PUNISHMENT, SCOLDING, CRATING, and
witholding rewards, attention, and affection:
Psychological Effects
At issue is the question, --Do electronic training
devices elicit psychological responses?
"This section cites several research studies in which the
psychological impact of the use of electronic training devices
was analyzed. It is difficult, at best, for anyone to determine
the full psychological effect of these devices or training methods
until we can agree on exactly what constitutes a stress signal in
a domestic dog. Not only do none of the researchers agree on
what it is, but it varies from dog to dog.
It is even more difficult for humans to determine the full effect
of shock on a dog (or any animal) due to the animal's hard-wired
need to hide pain in order to survive in the wild.
Training dogs with the help of the shock collar: Short and long
term behavioral effects. (Schilder, M. & van der Borga, J. (2004).
Applied Animal Behavior Science, 85, 319-334).
The goal of this study was to determine the behavioral changes in
dogs during training using electronic training collars. Thirty-two
dogs were divided into two groups, each receiving both general
obedience and protection training.
One group was trained with shock collars and the other group
without shock collars. The dogs trained with the shock collars
displayed signs of stress: lowering of body posture, high-pitched
yelps, barks and squeals, avoidance, redirected aggression, and
tongue flicking.
It was also noted by the authors that, even during play and relaxed
walking, the group of dogs trained with shock collars continued to
show signs of stress while in the company of their handler.
The authors concluded that shock-collar training is stressful;
receiving shocks is a painful experience to dogs; and the shock
group of dogs evidently learned that the presence of their owner
(or his commands) announced the reception of shocks, even
outside of the normal training context.
They suggest that the welfare of these shocked dogs is at
stake, at least in the presence of their owners.
This study has come under considerable fire because the experience
of the handlers and dogs is not clear, and the level of shock is not
stated. With that said, it does suggest that dogs are stressed by the
experience of being shocked during training.
---------------------
> All training collars are nasty if used improperly.
That so, matty?
"dallygirl" <kwickw...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> said in
rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> choke chains are outdated and barbaric in many
>cases causing more harm than good.
Back at you with flat buckle collars. These are an
incredibly abused training tool, what with the number
of handlers I see pulling back and jerking on the leash
with both hands.
It's a good thing that most of us are here because of
dogs' well-being and not an agenda.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
=============
Perhaps you'll teach us HOWE to use "TRAINING
COLLARS" pupperly so they won't be "NASTY", matty?
LIKE THIS, matty:
lyinglynn writes to a new foster care giver:
For barking in the crate - leave the leash on and
pass it through the crate door. Attach a line to
it. When he barks, use the line for a correction.-
if necessary, go to a citronella bark collar," Lynn K.
"Training is not confrontation,"Lynn K.
<except when it is>
"Unfortunately, some confrontation is necessary,
just to be able to handle the dogs. For example,
we need to crate train a dog immediately because
they are usually in need of medical care and they
are in foster homes with other dogs. It's a safety
necessity," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.
"Training is not confrontation,"Lynn K.
<except when it is>
"So what? Whoever said that it's right to
always not confront? We sure can try, but
a dog who knows a command and growls when
given it is certainly being confrontational".
You can't simply walk away and pretend it
didn't happen or leave it for later work in
every situation." Lynn K.
-----------------------------
"Granted That The Dog Who Fears Retribution Will
Adore His Owner," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.
Perahps tom should EXXXPERIMENT with CRATE BONDING?:
Re: New to us Pup, Tomorrow!
"cshenk" <cshe...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> "montana wildhack" wrote
>> You may want to move the crate into your bedroom.
>> Being "near" and "next to" are very different things.
> Actually I would if I could, but there isnt room.
Make room, even if the dresser or a side table has to go
away for a while. This is an im****tant bonding time.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
LIKE THIS:
Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2001
Subject: Re: shock collars
Sally Hennessey <greyho...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:b8m1dtsv6vuiblo63h8ekqiforibadrff2@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
from being incredibly offensive and self-
righteous, this post shows and absence of knowledge
in the differences in dogs' temperaments, or perhaps
a lack of ability to perceive same.
The fact that you, Alison, have never met a dog to
whom corrections and discomfort, even pain, were
unim****tant does not mean that such dogs do not exist.
What it means is that you don't know as much about
dogs as you think you do, and you surely don't know
a damn thing about Harlan or anyone else's dog here.
I had a Dalmatian that would instigate fights with
one of her housemates; that dog had no fear or
anything, and pain incurred during a fight meant
nothing to her.
I know that that dog is not unique, and I'm sure many
people here can tell similar stories. The fact that
you, Alison, continue to say things to people such as
what you said to Theresa about causing her dog to
suffer (at least I guess that's what you meant by
"you cause your dog suffers" - - must be the King's
English you guys talk about over there) means that
you are an ignorant, arrogant, insensitive person
who is not worth further notice.
Sally Hennessey
"Sally Hennessey" <greyho...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:54nuetsqgkhp26qqv128jnumgmb2m27opr@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Nope. No more than you'd convince Patch that
prongs and e-collars, in the right hands, are not
intrinsically abusive; or that dogs trained properly
with prongs or e-collars are not fearful, in pain, or
intimidated; or that any one of us here knows our
own dogs and their reactions better than someone
who has never seen them or us...hmmm.
I'm starting to see some similarities here.
Sally Hennessey
---------------
LIKE THIS:
"After Numerous Training Cl*****, Behavioral
Consultations, And Hundreds Of Dollars In Vet
Bills, I Killed My Dalmatian Several Years Ago
Due To Extreme Dog-Aggressiveness," mustang sally.
"I'll bet you don't know a thing about me.
I volunteered as assistant to the euthanasia
tech at our local shelter for a while, and
I know a bit about overpopulation and unwanted
animals.
This however has nothing at all to do with
responsible breeders, because responsible
breeders don't contribute to that problem,"
Mustang Sally.
AND LIKE THIS:
You wanna see matty's 'obviHOWES LIES' and IDIOTIC RESPONSES??
Here's more from your PAL matty:
From: Rocky <2dogsREM...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: 24 Jul 2004 04:00:53 GMT
Local: Fri, Jul 23 2004 11:00 pm
Subject: Re: Info. on the puppy wizard?
Cam said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> Everything he preaches is very positive, no
> correction, no punishment, all praise and love.
You are very wrong.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
From: Rocky <2d...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: 23 Nov 2003 02:40:42 GMT
Subject: Re: house training
steve braun said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> I dont like the insinuations that i am abusing
> my dog when i am NOT.
Then you may want to ignore the Puppy Wizard/Jerry Howe.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
From: Rocky <3da...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: 16 Aug 2002 18:40:54 GMT
Subject: Re: training a dog...
nancyj wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> The pressure meant a GOOD possibility if she could
> just push up hard enough, I'd understand. I did
> eventually <G>. I switched to a light tap!
Yup, once a dog learns to sit, a light tap
works as a reminder when they "forget".
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
But "NEVER HIT your dog", eh, matty?
From: "Nevyn" <greatd...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003 20:05:45 +0800
Subject: Re: puppy wizzards training manual.
G'DAY STEVE.
I used to be like you.
Then I found a book...it was called... the
wits end dog training manual.... and then
there was light..and perfectly trained dogs.
--
Thankyou,
Nevyn
Nevyn E.D.
Veterinary Nurse & Animal Trainer
greatd...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
"Yu agonna get whats comin' to you...for
all the bad bad things you to do your...dog"
________________________
"steve braun" <twopointerp...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:2d60c10a.0311231915.68b1241d@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> twopointerp...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(steve braun) wrote in message
<news:2d60c10a.0311231219.d2cf140@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>...
> > Hello, Mr. puppy wizzard, how do i find a copy of
> > your manual. Do you have a link that takes me to it?
>
> > I think i would like to read it.
>
> > Now i have another question for you in regards to
> > walking your dog. How do you feel about the gentle
> > leader? I bought one for each of my pups and the
> > difference in walking them is unbelievable. If you are
> > not sure what the gentle leader is check out their web
> > site at www.premier.com. If you are as good as you say
> > you are i want to read your manual.
> > thanks,
> > Steve
> > P.s. by the way my pup doesnt pee as soon as i put
> > him in his crate its after he's been in for a while
> > and cant hold it anymore that he pee's
> Howdy, jerry,
> well i started reading your manual, Im going to
> perfectly honest with you I thought last night when
> i started reading your posts you were full of crap
> but the more i read the more i could tell that you
> really do care about dogs. That is why asked for
> a copy of your manual.
>
> I really like your analogy on barking that was very
> interesting and gave it a perspective i never even thought
> of. As far as your praising the dogs when they are
> misbehaving i still dont understand how that works (i
> didnt get all that far in the manual yet.
>
> But i must say my female was clawing at the couch so i
> praised her like you say to do, i praised her twice for
> it and she stopped and came over to me.
>
> So i think what you have to say has merit, And for one
> am anxious to finish the book and get started because
> i love my dogs and really am looking forward to interacting
> with them on a positive note all of the time.
>
> This may be a little premature jerry, but
> Thank you
> Steve
Rocky wrote:
> Robin said in rec.pets.dogs.health:
> > Jerry, you give the lying dog abusing punk thug coward
> > mental cases too much credit for the ability to influence
Naaah, The Amazing Puppy Wizard was just BAITING these lying
dog abusing punk thug coward mental cases again <{); ~ ) >
> You really are a piece of work.
INDEEDY, matty. Robin studied and followed the INSTRUCTIONS
in her FREE COPY of The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100%
CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE
WWW Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual and RE****TED
her 100% NEARLY INSTANT SUCCESS RIGHT HERE on The
Amazing Puppy Wizard's FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training
Method Manual Forums And SCHOOL Of HARD KNOCKS
And HUMAN And ANIMAL BEHAVIOR RESEARCH
LABORATORIES, matty <{); ~ ) >
You're settin in it <{); ~ ) >
> Keep this out of the health groups, 'kay?
Dogs DIE from separation anXXXIHOWESNESS, matty, JUST
LIKE HOWE your own DEATHLY ILL dog Rocky is DYIN from
STRESS INDUCED AUTO-IMMUNE DIS-EASE aka The Puppy
Wizard's SYNDROME, on accHOWENT of you're a lyin dog abusin
punk thug coward MENTAL CASE, matty, and you can't post here
abHOWETS nodoGgamenedMOORE <{); ~ ) >
> --
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
"Rocky" <2...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:Xns92FEEC097E4AAaustralianshepherdca@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Linda wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> > When you compare using sound and
> > praise to solve a problem with using
> > shock collars, hanging, and punishment
> > how can you criticize the use of sound?
> There's nothing more to be said, then.
> You've made up your mind.
> But you've impressed me by mentioning
> that you're a professor with 30 years of
> experience.
\
> So, can you cite some examples of
> people recommending "shock collars,
> hanging, and punishment"?
> --
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
>> I do know that hitting, hurting your dog
>> will often make the dog either aggressive
>> or a fear biter, neither of which we want
>> to do.
>
> And neither does anyone else, Jerome.
> No matter what Jerry Howe states.
>
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
> BUT, giving you the benefit of the
> doubt, please provide a quote (an
> original quote, not from one of Jerry
> Howe's heavily edited diatribes) that
> shows a regular poster promoting or
> using an abusive form of training.
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
> So, can you cite some examples of
> people recommending "shock collars,
> hanging, and punishment"?
> --
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
>
> What's the point, but: Refer me to those posts of
> which you have read so many. While you're going
> through them, point out those which recommend
> shocking, and pinching, and beating. Thank you.
> --
> -Matt. Rocky's a Dog
> Rocky wrote:
> "Deltones" <vibrov...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> said in
> rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
>
> > After your defense of "Limited" choking, what
> > would be the point? Where I come from, choking
> > is choking. It's never limited.
>
> So, you can't point out abuse where none occurs.
> Thank you for your contribution.
>-
> --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
From: Rocky (2...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
)
Subject: Re: How to handle aggressive situations
Date: 2004-10-19 19:42:54 PST
Melanie L Chang said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> I try really hard not to yell. The times that I have,
> Solo joined in and then lunged to the end of the
>leash.
Or, at the other end of the spectrum, Rocky cowers,
thinking I'm angry at him - a reason I don't "yuk out"
others' dogs at agility trials or training.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
---------------
Sometimes my "voice of god" startles human
and dog, especially when the human didn't
see the inappropriate behaviour. --Matt.
Rocky's a Dog.
"Rocky" <2...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:Xns92C1EC10BFE7australianshepherdca@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Rosa Palmén wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> Anybody else got bilingual dogs?
Long ago my Hebrew was pretty good - but now I
only use "Chutza"(throat clearing 'ch') - "Out" when
it's reallyreally im****tant that my dogs get away from
something.
"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It A Sharp
Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack Wouldn't
Have Done It If He Thought Solo Couldn't Take It. I Still
Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear He Might Eat My
Cat," Melanie Lee Chang * mch...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Canine Behavioral Genetics Project
University of California, San Francisco
http://psych.ucsf.edu/K9BehavioralGenetics/
From: Rocky <2...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
Date: 10 Jun 2003 18:00:45 GMT
Subject: Re: Absolutely abysmal agility day
Robin Nuttall said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior
> One of the things that frustrates methe most about
> agility is that people seem to think that ALL dogs
> are fragile, shrinking flowers who cannot be
> corrected in any way.
Well, maybe one day -- when Friday doesn't take
correction so much to heart -- I'll try something
different. Right now, he's just getting the confidence
to work a few jumps ahead of me.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
"I crate Rocky, even though he's 8.5 years old, but
only when I'm gone during summertime days -
maybe an hour at the most. (Other than hot days,
my dogs are always with me.)
While Friday has been totally reliable unsupervised
from the day I got him from a rescue, Rocky has not.
Rocky will go looking for food even in areas where
there's no possibility of food.
The good thing is that he likes his crate, runs for
it when I ask, and gets food when he's in it.
--
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
BWEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAAA!!!
From: Rocky (mbon...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
)
Subject: Re: Leg Humper
Date: 1999/09/14
Bioso...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(Jerry Howe) wrote in
<37D698CF.405B0...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>:
> By "sticking your knee up," I can only presume
> that you are suggesting that the people knee the
> dog in the chest. If that's what you meant, just
> say it, instead of beating around the bush to avoid
> criticism from people like me. That kind of crap has
> got to stop, and that's why I'm here, to help wean
> you guys off of the abuse and into the proper methods
> of dealing with behavior problems.
Jerry, I was appreciating your explanation
up until this last paragraph.
Why did you blow it?
--Matt
"dallygirl" <kwickw...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> said in
rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> choke chains are outdated and barbaric in many
>cases causing more harm than good.
Back at you with flat buckle collars. These are an
incredibly abused training tool, what with the number
of handlers I see pulling back and jerking on the leash
with both hands.
It's a good thing that most of us are here because of
dogs' well-being and not an agenda.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
=============
BWEEEEAHAHAHHAAA!!!
Here's HOWER DOG LOVER pal sgt grant teebon, RAAF:
"Reliable Punishment Cycles, Different Thresholds
To Pain And Punishment, High Tolerance For
Correction, Escalation Of Correction To A Level
Where The Dog Yelps When You Punish Him,
Thus Making The Experience One Which The Dog
Will Want To Avoid In The Future," grant teeboon,
RAAF.
Here's HOWER DOG LOVER pal captain
arthur haggerty, USArmy K-9 Corps:
captain arthur haggerty SEZ: "A CHIN CHUCK"
Makes A ResoundingSound Distraction: "When
You Chuck The Dog The Sound Will Travel Up
The Mandible To The Ears And Give A Popping
Sound To The Dog."
lying frosty dahl writes:
"Get a stick 30- or 40-inches long. You can have a
helper wield the stick, or do it yourself. Tougher, less
tractable dogs may require you to progress to striking
them more sharply.
With your hand on the collar and ear, say, 'fetch.'
Immediately tap the dog on the hindquarters with the
stick. Repeat "fetch" and pinch the ear all the way to
the dummy.
Repeat, varying how hard you hit the dog,
Now you are ready to progress to what most
people think of as force-fetching: the ear pinch.
Make the dog's need to stop the pinching so urgent
that resisting your will fades in im****tance.
but will squeal, thrash around, and direct their
efforts to escaping the ear pinch
You can press the dog's ear with a shotshell
instead of your thumb;
even get a studded collar and pinch the ear against that
Say "fetch" while pressing the dummy
against its lips and pinching its ear.
if the dog still does not open its mouth,
get out the shotshell.
Try pinching the ear between the metal casing
and the collar, even the buckle on the collar.
Persist! Eventually, the dog will give in"
==============
"The Koehler Method of Dog Training"
Howell Book House, 1996"
Koehler On Correcting The Housebreaking Backslider.
"If the punishment is not severe enough, some of these
"backsliders" will think they're winning and will
continue to mess in the house. An indelible impression
can sometimes be made by giving the dog a hard
spanking of long duration, then leaving him tied by
the mess he's made so you can come back at twenty
minute intervals and punish him again for the same
thing. (Dogs are REALLY stupid. J.H.)
In most cases, the dog that deliberately does this
disagreeable thing cannot be made reliable by the
light spanking that some owners seem to think is
adequate punishment. It will be better for your dog,
as well as the house, if you really pour it on him."
"Housebreaking Problems:
"The Koehler Method of Dog Training"
Howell Book House, 1996"
Occasionally, there is a pup who seems determined to
relieve himself inside the house, regardless of how
often he has the op****tunity to go outside. This dog
may require punishment. Make certain he is equipped
with a collar and piece of line so he can't avoid
correction.
When you discover a mess, move in fast, take him to
the place of his error, and hold his head close enough
so that he associates his error with the punishment.
Punish him by spanking him with a light strap or
switch. Either one is better than a folded newspaper.
It is im****tant to your future relation****p that you
do not rush at him and start swinging before you get
hold of him.
When he's been spanked, take him outside. Chances
are, if you are careful in your feeding and close
observation, you will not have to do much puni****ng.
Be consistent in your handling.
To have a pup almost house-broken and then force
him to commit an error by not providing an op****tunity
to go outside is very unfair. Careful planning will
make your job easier.
The same general techniques of housebreaking apply
to grown dogs that are inexperienced in the house.
For the grown dog who was reliable in the house and
then backslides, the method of correction differs
somewhat. In this group of "backsliders" we have the
"revenge piddler." This dog protests being alone by
messing on the floor and often in the middle of a bed.
The first step of correction is to confine the dog
closely in a part of the house when you go away, so
that he is constantly reminded of his obligation. The
fact that he once was reliable in the house is proof
that the dog knows right from wrong, and it leaves
you no other course than to punish him sufficiently
to convince him that the satisfaction of his
wrongdoing is not worth the consequences. If the
punishment is not severe enough, some of these
"backsliders" will think they're winning and will
continue to mess in the house.
An indelible impression can sometimes be made
by giving the dog a hard spanking of long duration,
then leaving him tied by the mess he's made so you
can come back at twenty minute intervals and punish
him again for the same thing.
In most cases, the dog that deliberately does this
disagreeable thing cannot be made reliable by the
light spanking that some owners seem to think is
adequate punishment.
It will be better for your dog, as well as the house,
if you really pour it on him.
---------------------
AIN'T GOT NO AGENDAS HERE, SEE??
"Loop the lead (it's basically a GIANT nylon or leather
choke collar) over his snarly little head, and give him a
stern correction" --Janet Boss
http://tinyurl.com/5m6ppt
"J1Boss" <j1b...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:20040324071828.07753.00000001@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
He was next to me and I could see his neck
muscles pulsing. He didn't even blink an eye.
Janet Boss
"sionnach" <rhyfe...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:c3qi15$2biuoh$1@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> "J1Boss" <j1b...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
> news:20040323173916.10096.00001938@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > I can't imagine needing anything higher
> > than a 5 with it, even with an insensitive
> > dog like a Lab.
An INSENSITIVE DOG???
> > I can't remember what model of Innotek I have, but
> > I had a pointer ignore a neck-muscle-pulsing 9.
Do you think the citronella collar is CRUEL
cause the SMELL LINGERS after the dog's
been sprayed in the face and the dog won't
know HOWE COME IT was MACED?
janet CONtinues:
> > My dogs are not human children wearing fur- they are DOGS.
> > I don't have anything against electronic bark collars, but they
> > should be used in conjunction with actually working at training
> > your dog(s).
They're DUMB ANIMALS these MENTALLY ILL LYING
DOG ABUSERS HURT INTIMIDATE and MURDER.
-------------------
LIKE THIS:
"Pudge Was So Soft That She Could And
Would Avoid A Simple Swat On The Rump
With A Riding Crop," lying frosty dahl,
discoverer of CANNIBALISM in Labradors.
--------------------
From: BethF (d...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
)
Subject: Re: to treat or not to treat
Date: 2002-01-14 12:50:27 PST
> "Jerry Howe" <jho...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
<news:8TI%7.10635$du.948527@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>...
> > And you jerk and choke your dogs on pronged spiked pinch
> > choke collars lock them in boxes and call that training
> > and spray Binaca in their eyes to quite their crate anxiety barking...
I dont' jerk or choke my dog (the little one is
too little yet for a pinch collar). They simply
wear pinch collars.
It prevents any jerking or choking on their part.
I do crate my dogs - the big one only at the dog
club and to travel, and the little one so he can
become accustomed to being in a crate.
He is learning to enjoy it and to use it as a place
to rest from the playing that he and Kavik do
..
I used binaca to quiet Kavik's in class whining
that disturbed the class. It would be quite difficult
to binaca a dog that is in a crate.
I did hit him in the eye accidentally, and stopped
using it at that time. Jerry, have you NEVER made
an error in training the dogs you have trained?
How many dogs have you trained exactly?
Can you list some references here - I
would like to contact some of your former
clients to get a reference or two?
------------------
AND LIKE THIS:
lyinglynn writes to a new foster care giver:
For barking in the crate - leave the leash on and
pass it through the crate door. Attach a line to
it. When he barks, use the line for a correction.-
if necessary, go to a citronella bark collar," Lynn K.
"Training is not confrontation,"Lynn K.
<except when it is>
"Unfortunately, some confrontation is necessary,
just to be able to handle the dogs. For example,
we need to crate train a dog immediately because
they are usually in need of medical care and they
are in foster homes with other dogs. It's a safety
necessity," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.
"Training is not confrontation,"Lynn K.
<except when it is>
"So what? Whoever said that it's right to
always not confront? We sure can try, but
a dog who knows a command and growls when
given it is certainly being confrontational".
You can't simply walk away and pretend it
didn't happen or leave it for later work in
every situation." Lynn K.
-----------------------------
AND LIKE THIS:
"Well, actually the binaca worked but after i
got him in the eye it was not a possibility to
be using that."
"Actually, the most common use of this technique
(and it is quite common) is with TABASCO sauce
either mixed with water in a spray bottle or on a rag
that you can stick in the dogs mouth instead of spraying
(after our experience I would suggest this method if I
was going to use this technique again). My dog likes
tabasco so that didnt' work for us.
Binaca was suggested as an alternative from a very
well respected dog trainer from the lower 48, however
I don't think she counted on his flailing his head in a
desperate attempt to get away from the sprayer causing
me to miss."
------------------
AND LIKE THIS:
"BethF" <d...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:uohnj3r4a4e85e@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Maybe that's what we should do - hold back the dobie
girl so that Izzy can put Simon in his place.
--------------------
"BethF" <b...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
wrote in message
news:v4r8kkfr257e1a@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Kyle, FWIW, i thought it was pretty funny,
and i often call my little dog the turd, because
he is one. Some folks think its HORRRIBLE i
would insult my dog like that so i guess its just a
matter of personality.
Kyle, the best way to teach him to stay away is to
step on him once. Seriously.
--------------
"Granted That The Dog Who Fears Retribution Will
Adore His Owner," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.
AND LIKE THIS:
Here's tommy sorenson of sorenson's Retriever PUPPY MILL
and SHOCK COLLAR trainin SALES aka the miserable stinkin
lyin animal murderin child an spHOWES abusin anonymHOWES
active accute chronic life long incurable mental case punk
thug coward aka not so handsome, not so gentle, not so manly
jackass, not even jack morrison, aka joey finochiarrio aka
BIG DADDY aka DOGMAN HEELPIN dogs:
tommy sez:
At no time do the Monks *ever* advocate beating a
dog. A swat on the rump or a check to the chin does
*not* constitute a "beating."
And then he sez:
"I don't know how big you are, kiddo, so this may
not be as easy for you as it is for me, but use
a little "knee action," that is, as the dog goes
charging by you, just give the dog a little bop
with your knee and ****n. Yep, really lean into it.
Even knock her over, if you can, but make sure to
make her think twice about ru****ng past you again -
- which is exactly what you want her to do.
Don't bother with scolding her, she'll get the message.
If it happens again, just REPEAT the knee action.
When she steps on your toes, just pick up your foot
abruptly and ****ge her with your knee. Again, no
scolding is necessary here, so you don't have to
worry about her "over-reacting."
I don't think this is necessarily a lack of respect
for you, just a lack of training. That is, she just
needs *more* of it."
You mean like HOWE when you HOWEsbreak a dog an
you beat IT with a switch or heavy man's leather belt and
tie him next to his evil deed and return to BEAT HIM every
twenty minutes, tommy?
tommy SEZ:
"My objective is always to find a way that WORKS.
And if it is DANGEROUS behavior that I'm trying
to modify, behavior than can get the dog KILLED,
I will resort to ANYTHING to save him.
A-N-Y-T-H-I-N-G.
Okay. Call me a cruel, inhumane, abusive bastard
if you want to, but it doesn't affect me at all.
When you've saved the lives of as many dogs as I
have, you'll learn that that's the only thing that
really matters. Saving lives and making dogs become
good citizens"
"Swatting a dog on the nose is always the wrong thing to do."
> Or do you think he got off easy?
Perhaps we should just KILL HIM.
LIKE THIS:
"I used to work the Kill Room as a volunteer in
one shelter.) But their ability to set their own
schedules and duties causes a great deal of
scheduling overhead.
And it takes effort and thought to ensure that
volunteers get the meaningful experience that
they work for.
Someone has to be responsible for that
Volunteer Program, and it is best done
by a non-volunteer."
Lynn K.
----------------
"I worked with one shelter where I bathed and groomed
every adoptable dog on intake. I frankly felt that the
effort/benefit equation was not balanced for some of the
older/ill poodle/terrier mixes we got in badly matted condition.
Should I have refused to groom them?
Or even more pertinent - I was one of the people who
had to make the euthanasia decisions at that shelter."
Lynn K.
----------------
AND LIKE THIS:
I'll be you've never had to put down litters of
beautiful labrador puppies? If you had did, maybe
you'd be singing a different tune?
"Actually, have held them for the tech to euth, and
put their bodies in the trash bag and in the freezer
for the trash company to come and dispose of.
No different tune," ~Emily
~emily is a vivisectionist for a med research laboratory.
------------------
AND LIKE THIS:
"After Numerous Training Cl*****, Behavioral
Consultations, And Hundreds Of Dollars In Vet
Bills, I Killed My Dalmatian Several Years Ago
Due To Extreme Dog-Aggressiveness," mustang sally.
"I'll bet you don't know a thing about me.
I volunteered as assistant to the euthanasia
tech at our local shelter for a while, and
I know a bit about overpopulation and unwanted
animals.
This however has nothing at all to do with
responsible breeders, because responsible
breeders don't contribute to that problem,"
Mustang Sally.
Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2001
Subject: Re: shock collars
Sally Hennessey <greyho...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:b8m1dtsv6vuiblo63h8ekqiforibadrff2@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
from being incredibly offensive and self-
righteous, this post shows and absence of knowledge
in the differences in dogs' temperaments, or perhaps
a lack of ability to perceive same.
The fact that you, Alison, have never met a dog to
whom corrections and discomfort, even pain, were
unim****tant does not mean that such dogs do not exist.
What it means is that you don't know as much about
dogs as you think you do, and you surely don't know
a damn thing about Harlan or anyone else's dog here.
I had a Dalmatian that would instigate fights with
one of her housemates; that dog had no fear or
anything, and pain incurred during a fight meant
nothing to her.
I know that that dog is not unique, and I'm sure many
people here can tell similar stories. The fact that
you, Alison, continue to say things to people such as
what you said to Theresa about causing her dog to
suffer (at least I guess that's what you meant by
"you cause your dog suffers" - - must be the King's
English you guys talk about over there) means that
you are an ignorant, arrogant, insensitive person
who is not worth further notice.
Sally Hennessey
"Sally Hennessey" <greyho...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:54nuetsqgkhp26qqv128jnumgmb2m27opr@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Nope. No more than you'd convince Patch that
prongs and e-collars, in the right hands, are not
intrinsically abusive; or that dogs trained properly
with prongs or e-collars are not fearful, in pain, or
intimidated; or that any one of us here knows our
own dogs and their reactions better than someone
who has never seen them or us...hmmm.
I'm starting to see some similarities here.
Sally Hennessey
---------------
Here's janet's PARTNER:
"The actual quote is misleading when taken out of context,"
sinofa***** writes:
> > What I have said- repeatedly - is that he
> > took posts from two different people,
No, there was ONLY WON quote.
> > took pieces of them out of context,
Of curse. QUOTED. You wanna see it in context?
> > cobbled them together,
No. There was WON DIRECT QUOTE.
> > then added his own words:
"Neatly," and "Smartly."
> > and a fake signature.
"sinofa*****" instead of sionnach.
> > Which is exactly what he did.
INDEEDY. That's HOWE COME you deny it.
> > The actual quote is misleading
That so?
> > when taken out of context,
We'd been talkin abHOWET beatin the dog with a shoe...
> > and Jerry's faked "quote"
The WON sinofa***** totally DENIES.
> > is downright meaningless.
Only if you're a MENTAL CASE.
Here's Jerry's version
"I Dropped The Leash, Threw My
Right Arm Over The Lab's Shoulder,
Grabbed Her Opposite Foot With My
Left Hand, Rolled Her On Her Side,
Leaned On Her, Smartly Growled Into
Her Throat And Said "GRRRR!" And
Neatly Nipped Her Ear," sinofa*****.
Here's yours:
"I dropped the leash, threw my
right arm over the Lab's shoulder,
grabbed her opposite foot with my
left hand, rolled her on her side,
leaned on her, said "GRRRR!" and
nipped her ear.
--Sara Sionnach
"The actual quote is misleading when taken out of context"
See?
Here's HOWER DOG LOVER PAL an janet's
REAL LIFE IN PERSON "students" paul an Muttley:
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <pst...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
It is a shame that Muttley will probably be put
down (his appointment is next Wednesday),
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <pst...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
Hello everyone:
If you have followed some of my posts, you know
something about the ongoing story of Muttley, the
large GSD/Chow dog I have been trying to adopt
or place in a better home.
I will add a bit more history later in this post.
Last Tuesday, toward the end of Janet's obedience
class, Muttley and I had just finished fairly successfully
performing a sit/stay/come routine, and then he was
sitting by my side.
The final routine was to be a "down", which Muttley
has had some difficulty with, and frankly I have not
had the time to work with him much on that.
I was kneeling at his side, trying to hold his collar
while pu****ng his front legs down to the position,
while he resisted. Suddenly he lunged, knocking
me over onto the parking lot, and I lost grip of the
leash as I reflexively broke my fall.
Muttley took the op****tunity to attack a young black
male Lab to my left, and it was a very brutal attack.
Janet and the instructors tried to gain control, and as
soon as I could get to my feet I grabbed the leash and
pulled him off.
That was the end of the class, and the other dog,
Bernie, was taken to an animal hospital for treatment.
When everyone had left, Janet counseled me about
what should be done about Muttley.
She said this was more than ordinary aggression,
and only intensive (and expensive) one on one
training would have any chance at working, and
in any case, he was not suited to group training.
She advised me that Muttley could be dangerous,
and she recommended that he be euthanized.
"They can't all be saved".
<snip>
--------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <pst...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
<snip>
If I did not have to worry about my cat, I would
probably keep him, and I am certain I could avoid
any more dangerous episodes. I probably would
not have taken him to obedience cl***** at this time
if that was not such a difficult issue, and if people
here had not essentially shamed me into doing so.
Then he would only be a bratty dog with a mind of
his own, but he would not have been identified as
dangerous.
--------------------------
BWEEEAAAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!
Here's HOWER DOG LOVER PAL an janet's
REAL LIFE IN PERSON "student" paul:
#2 - 6/05/07
>> When I was training him under Janet's supervision
>> I was instructed to give it a ? firm yank as a correction.
> I advised you to use a prong collar, not give firm
> yanks on a chain choke collar. I hate the things.
>> She was able to get his attention with
>> just a quick tug, but I had to yank on it
>> hard enough to lift him off his feet to get
>> him to respond. Looking back now, I think
>> it was based on his fear, which he had for
>> her (as an unknown), but not for me
>> (whom he had learned to trust).
> He wasn't afraid of me. He knew I was a
> confident trainer. Fear has no place in dog
> training, as I told you THEN.
> Janet
It seems to me that applying stern corrections, by
popping a choker chain, prong collar, or whatever,
is a way to ensure compliance by instilling a fear
of further punishment.
Sure, if it is administered very consistently
by a confident trainer, the dog soon learns
to obey. There was no positive reinforcement,
so what remains is negative.
Also, I recall the time you were going to show me
how I could get Muttley to take his rawhide treat
from me without lunging for it. When you offered
it to him, he refused to take it. This IMHO is likely
a fear behavior.
Things have changed a lot since then, and I have
learned a lot, and Muttley has settled down quite
a bit. I probably still give him too much freedom
to think on his own, but that's just my way of
doing things, and that's probably not going to
change much. He may never win an obedience
medal, but I don't think he is dangerously out
of control, either.
Paul and Muttley
----------------
"I thought I was told that the way to get the dog to go
down was to make him sit and then step on the leash.
That was awkward and didn't seem to work.
I will confess that I only tried the "down" position
once or twice at home, and I also often used it
instead of "Off" when I wanted him to stop
jumping on me or elsewhere I didn't want him to be.
I had to give him corrections every few seconds,
and also just about kick him, to keep him at my
left side.
Muttley is really a very sweet and loving dog, but
he needs more socialization with other dogs. However,
it is very likely that I will have him put down in a week."
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <pst...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
It is a shame that Muttley will probably be put
down (his appointment is next Wednesday),
-----------------------
THAT'S quite a SUCCESS STORY, ain't it, paulie?
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
HERE'S HOWE COME:
Subject: Re: redirected aggression
Date: 4/11/07
"Janet Boss" <janet@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:janet-730AB8.17321511042007@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
seems I have been dealing with this a bit lately.
Dog to dog and dog to person,, with dogs who are
obviously overstimulated by what's in front of them.
What's in front of them varies from people at the door
to dogs in their path or directly in their face. The dogs
in question all have very poor self control.
I have dog(s) with not-so-great-natural self control,
so it's something we constantly work on. We don't
have redirected stuff going on, because we have enough
obedience to avoid it.
While I know that's the big answer for the dogs in
question as well, I'm curious what things people have
found useful to redirect/focus/gain attention from
drivey dogs or just very distracted of over-the-top dogs.
We're having success with my recommendations, but I'm
always open to something novel that may be the hot ticket.
--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com
-------------------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
SEE??
"dallygirl" <kwickw...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> said in
rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> choke chains are outdated and barbaric in many
>cases causing more harm than good.
Back at you with flat buckle collars. These are an
incredibly abused training tool, what with the number
of handlers I see pulling back and jerking on the leash
with both hands.
It's a good thing that most of us are here because of
dogs' well-being and not an agenda.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
=============
SEE??
We AIN'T GOT nodoGdameneD agendas here, do we <{}: ~ ( >
From: ms...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(Mark Shaw)
Date: 27 Aug 2001 23:00:48 -0400
Subject: Re: Anyone tried the Wits End Training manual?
In article <3532-3B895199...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>,
Momi...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(misty) wrote:
> I needed the info, it was offered free of charge
> and any questions can be asked of Jerry.
This is not true, unless you're willing to kiss his, uh, ring.
If you're not, he considers you his enemy -- no matter how you
really feel about him -- and will just abuse you.
Of course, his sheep have always ignored
this and will probably continue to do so.
--
Mark Shaw (and Maggie)anti-spam: change 'bang' to 'not'
------------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
|
